Is it just me, or is there a greater-than-average amount of closed-mindedness here?

[conuly]

She homeschools! She doesn't like the idea of tests and homework! She must be stupid!

I love the assumptions:

There's no way to judge how much a student learned unless you give tests and homework. Well, yeah, I guess they could check class participation and classwork - but how could there possibly be enough time??? Because all my classes, which ran on the "tests and homework" idea, were lecture-based, so this class must ALSO be large and lecture based, and there wouldn't be enough time to do classwork. I've never heard of class discussions, or labwork before!

And:

She withdrew her kids over this! She must not want them to learn! This must make her a bible-thumping fundie!

Aside from the obvious WTF prejudice, I have this to say: Of course, you can't learn unless you have homework and tests! This, despite the studies saying that homework and tests can be detrimental to actual learning. Seriously, think back: which did you learn better, the subject you didn't stress out over but instead liked, or the subject which had lots of tests, which you crammed for? Even if you disagree, which is fair, do you *really* think that there's no other way to learn than by lectures, homework, and tests?

Comments

[neurotica0.livejournal.com]

I see you trying to battle the ignorance and prejudice over there, but the audience just isn't listening to you. It's sad really, because I think you have quite a valid point.

[conuly]

Eh, I cite the failure of the traditional school system. It's not their fault.

Actually, strike that. The traditional school system has succeeded in its ultimate goal, which was to indoctrinate them and convince them that they're incapable of learning without lectures, homework, and tests, thus ensuring the survival of the traditional school system and related industries.

[firingneurons.livejournal.com]

I don't know, it doesn't say that the woman didn't like the idea of homework and tests, just that she didn't realise they had it.

I don't know that it's particularly stupid, considering the child is homeschooled and we don't know for how long, so she could be unaccustomed to the way most schools do things.

I found the 'stupidest' part to be that the woman (from the post's description) seemed surprised that a course would have homework/tests when she herself is being the teacher. And presumably, she evaluates her kid's work through some sort of testing.

[conuly]

I don't know, it doesn't say that the woman didn't like the idea of homework and tests, just that she didn't realise they had it.

At which point she withdrew her students. I think the idea that she doesn't like homework and tests makes sense, don't you?

And presumably, she evaluates her kid's work through some sort of testing.

Why?

[priyatelka.livejournal.com]

I homeschool and I didn't start giving tests until last year. I did this so I would have some sort of "standardized" verification of my childrens' progress should I have any problems with the school board.

However, *I* don't need to test them. As their mother I know them both intimately and can tell when they're "getting" something and when they're not, as their teacher, I have only two students with whom I spend 5+ hours a day with, five days a week, going over everything, answering questions, discussing things with them.

My kids have been back in school since Tuesday and in science we are currently covering human cellular structure. They are 10 and 7 years old. They have never studied cellular structure before. They were discussing it with their father tonight when he returned home from work and my my husband said something about mitochondrion being his favorite parts of the cell. My seven year old daughter turned to him and said "Daddy, it's mitochondria if it's more than one. Mitochondrion is for just one."

This tells me that not only has she absorbed information about the organelles of cells, but that she also understands singular and plural forms of words. In one sentence. No test required.

I read what you wrote at the other page, Connie, thanks for defending us (homeschoolers). And thank you for being open-minded enough to know that not all of us are Bible-thumpers or idiots.

[conuly]

I read what you wrote at the other page, Connie, thanks for defending us (homeschoolers). And thank you for being open-minded enough to know that not all of us are Bible-thumpers or idiots.

Eh, no problem. Some people need saving from the stupid people more than most.

[pyrokinesis.livejournal.com]

*waves* I saw you fighting for the cause in mock_the_stupid and remembered you from the sinfest feed when I actually made icons out of them. Decided to add you to my friends list.

Um. I have nothing relevant to say at the moment, unfortunately. Hi.

[conuly]

Wow, the feed was a LONG time ago. Hi!

[tsukikage85.livejournal.com]

Personally, I need grades and homework to get me to actually read the materials, and I'm horrible with hands-on projects, but I know many people who have succeeded in alternative schools that didn't do the whole Battle Royale-style academics.

[conuly]

We're all individuals :)

Philosophically, I think the whole test-homework mentality is insulting to the students. It's a bit like saying "we don't trust you to do the work, so we're going to force you to do it anyway". I understand that schools need SOME way to evaluate progress, and testing is the easiest way, but that doesn't mean I have to like it.

[xmorningxrosex.livejournal.com]

agreed! I'm doing my internship, and we have no tests - 2 papers to "prove" that we're learning something (but they're just introspection type papers and little research) and daily journal entries. Both of those are just for the school though, the agency I'm working at only evaluates me by what I'm doing, NOT through assignments or tests or anything like that. It's cool because I really am learning a lot, and I don't have to waste time cramming for tests or anything because I'm actually USING what I'm learning.

[conuly]

How strange. This must not, according to that girl, be "real" learning - because everybody knows that involves homework.

[fjorab-teke.livejournal.com]

The greatest amount of learning I did was indeed with things I LIKED. Usually I liked them enough to study on my own in sheer interest.

Math? Oh Dell's Math Puzzles and Logic Problems! Horses? Forget my college degree...buy me books and magazines and let me loose with a few horses! P.E.? Let me out there (haha my high school mentality at work) with a bunch of guys I have crushes on, playing games I like but probably am no good at but having fun and trying to show off anyway! Mistory and geography? I HATED them in school and struggled horribly. My geography has been improved with interest in world horse breeds and where my internet friends live. I also LOVE backroad driving and studying maps. My interest in history is on ancient world cultures, how they developed, what their lives were most probably like, and how they interacted. Ancient myths with factual bases (Troy, Biblical stories IMO)...fascinating!

Force me to do it, and I'll hate it. Give me something interesting to investigate on my own without obligations, and I soak it up like a sponge.

Scary, how you surface a point that I've known all along with myself but never really questioned or outright expressed.

[neurotica0.livejournal.com]

I see you trying to battle the ignorance and prejudice over there, but the audience just isn't listening to you. It's sad really, because I think you have quite a valid point.

[conuly]

Eh, I cite the failure of the traditional school system. It's not their fault.

Actually, strike that. The traditional school system has succeeded in its ultimate goal, which was to indoctrinate them and convince them that they're incapable of learning without lectures, homework, and tests, thus ensuring the survival of the traditional school system and related industries.

[firingneurons.livejournal.com]

I don't know, it doesn't say that the woman didn't like the idea of homework and tests, just that she didn't realise they had it.

I don't know that it's particularly stupid, considering the child is homeschooled and we don't know for how long, so she could be unaccustomed to the way most schools do things.

I found the 'stupidest' part to be that the woman (from the post's description) seemed surprised that a course would have homework/tests when she herself is being the teacher. And presumably, she evaluates her kid's work through some sort of testing.

[conuly]

I don't know, it doesn't say that the woman didn't like the idea of homework and tests, just that she didn't realise they had it.

At which point she withdrew her students. I think the idea that she doesn't like homework and tests makes sense, don't you?

And presumably, she evaluates her kid's work through some sort of testing.

Why?

[priyatelka.livejournal.com]

I homeschool and I didn't start giving tests until last year. I did this so I would have some sort of "standardized" verification of my childrens' progress should I have any problems with the school board.

However, *I* don't need to test them. As their mother I know them both intimately and can tell when they're "getting" something and when they're not, as their teacher, I have only two students with whom I spend 5+ hours a day with, five days a week, going over everything, answering questions, discussing things with them.

My kids have been back in school since Tuesday and in science we are currently covering human cellular structure. They are 10 and 7 years old. They have never studied cellular structure before. They were discussing it with their father tonight when he returned home from work and my my husband said something about mitochondrion being his favorite parts of the cell. My seven year old daughter turned to him and said "Daddy, it's mitochondria if it's more than one. Mitochondrion is for just one."

This tells me that not only has she absorbed information about the organelles of cells, but that she also understands singular and plural forms of words. In one sentence. No test required.

I read what you wrote at the other page, Connie, thanks for defending us (homeschoolers). And thank you for being open-minded enough to know that not all of us are Bible-thumpers or idiots.

[conuly]

I read what you wrote at the other page, Connie, thanks for defending us (homeschoolers). And thank you for being open-minded enough to know that not all of us are Bible-thumpers or idiots.

Eh, no problem. Some people need saving from the stupid people more than most.

[pyrokinesis.livejournal.com]

*waves* I saw you fighting for the cause in mock_the_stupid and remembered you from the sinfest feed when I actually made icons out of them. Decided to add you to my friends list.

Um. I have nothing relevant to say at the moment, unfortunately. Hi.

[conuly]

Wow, the feed was a LONG time ago. Hi!

[tsukikage85.livejournal.com]

Personally, I need grades and homework to get me to actually read the materials, and I'm horrible with hands-on projects, but I know many people who have succeeded in alternative schools that didn't do the whole Battle Royale-style academics.

[conuly]

We're all individuals :)

Philosophically, I think the whole test-homework mentality is insulting to the students. It's a bit like saying "we don't trust you to do the work, so we're going to force you to do it anyway". I understand that schools need SOME way to evaluate progress, and testing is the easiest way, but that doesn't mean I have to like it.

[xmorningxrosex.livejournal.com]

agreed! I'm doing my internship, and we have no tests - 2 papers to "prove" that we're learning something (but they're just introspection type papers and little research) and daily journal entries. Both of those are just for the school though, the agency I'm working at only evaluates me by what I'm doing, NOT through assignments or tests or anything like that. It's cool because I really am learning a lot, and I don't have to waste time cramming for tests or anything because I'm actually USING what I'm learning.

[conuly]

How strange. This must not, according to that girl, be "real" learning - because everybody knows that involves homework.

[fjorab-teke.livejournal.com]

The greatest amount of learning I did was indeed with things I LIKED. Usually I liked them enough to study on my own in sheer interest.

Math? Oh Dell's Math Puzzles and Logic Problems! Horses? Forget my college degree...buy me books and magazines and let me loose with a few horses! P.E.? Let me out there (haha my high school mentality at work) with a bunch of guys I have crushes on, playing games I like but probably am no good at but having fun and trying to show off anyway! Mistory and geography? I HATED them in school and struggled horribly. My geography has been improved with interest in world horse breeds and where my internet friends live. I also LOVE backroad driving and studying maps. My interest in history is on ancient world cultures, how they developed, what their lives were most probably like, and how they interacted. Ancient myths with factual bases (Troy, Biblical stories IMO)...fascinating!

Force me to do it, and I'll hate it. Give me something interesting to investigate on my own without obligations, and I soak it up like a sponge.

Scary, how you surface a point that I've known all along with myself but never really questioned or outright expressed.