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conulywho was ranting at a third person all about how homeschooling is selfish and narcissistic because when you do it you've decided that you're the best and only person to educate your child and keep them from learning other points of view etc.
I've come across this argument a few times before. Factually, it's bizarre. Emotionally, it's the anti-homeschool equivalent of "why did you even have kids if you were going to send them to daycare and let strangers raise them!!!!!" These people cannot be reasoned with and don't particularly want to be. They just want to be mean.
However, I'm sure most of us are a bit more familiar with daycare and brick-and-mortar schooling than with homeschooling, and might be taken in by a more calmly phrased variation on the first person's argument, so I'm making this post for your edification. Most of this is all pretty obvious if you sit down and think about it.
1. First things first, homeschooling is not an all-or-nothing proposition. It's common to homeschool for some years and not others, or to homeschool some children but not others, or both. It's very common for children to go to school for high school. And in areas that allow dual enrollment a great many children take classes at the public school while still being homeschooled.
2. Even while you're homeschooling, and even without dual enrollment, your child might take classes taught by somebody other than you. They might take "afterschool" programs, homeschool co-op classes, or online classes. Or they might have a private or semi-private tutor. These classes might be arranged to be primarily for socialization, or to offer enrichment, or to teach subjects which parents aren't comfortable handling themselves. Outside classes are extremely common.
Points one and two already show that not every homeschooler gets into it because they really hate the idea of somebody else teaching their precious babies. Actually, I've heard many reasons for homeschooling, including:
A. I want to include religion in the school day.
B. I want to make all my teaching connected to my religion!
C. There was too much religion in my local school.
D. My local school isn't very good academically.
E. My local school is dangerous or has a bullying problem.
F. I don't trust the public schools all that much.
G. My local school is adequate, but it wasn't a good fit for my child.
H. My child is gifted, and there wasn't enough differentiation.
I. My child has a disability, and there wasn't enough support.
J. My child is 2E, and there wasn't enough differentiation OR support.
K. My child would like to spend a lot of time focusing on a special interest (music, dance, herpetology), and it was either homeschool or not have a social life.
L. We live very far away from our school and honestly the commute was killing us.
M. We like to school in our PJs.
N. We move a lot, and I'd like my child's education to be more consistent.
O. My child asked to homeschool for reasons.
P. I specifically don't like the way our schools handle a particular issue.
Q. I would like all my children to graduate college by the time they're 19.
R. I believe in allowing my children a great deal of academic freedom ("unschooling").
S. I believe in allowing my children infinite academic freedom ("radical unschooling").
T. I want my child to have more free time to play with friends.
U. We have an illness/allergy situation and my child is safer at home.
V. One of us is probably not going to be around in five years, and while I still can I'd like to maximize our time together.
W. We have specific dietary rules my child has to follow, and during the earlier years it's easier to do that this way.
X. I'd like to do more trips and experiential learning than the schools generally provide, without sacrificing free time in the afternoons and weekends.
Now, I'm not going to claim that all these reasons are equal. However, "I don't think anybody can ever teach my child better than I can" is conspicuously not on the list. You sometimes see a variant of this - "I believe I'm the best teacher for the early years" - but even then....
3. Then we have two variations on the socialization argument. Either homeschool kids can't socialize, or they'll only socialize with people like them. Now, socialization is a real issue, and the careful homeschooling family makes sure to provide plenty of time with peers, ideally in both structured and unstructured activities.
However, it's worth noting that students in a classroom setting may not get much socialization time either if they don't have recess. I was told as a child, repeatedly, that my class was not in school to socialize but to learn. Careful questioning suggests that many parents and teachers are still rattling this off to students today... until the homeschool issue comes up, when classrooms are suddenly the only way to socialize.
And when socialization does happen in schools, there's no guarantee that those students are being exposed to a variety of views and experiences. The USA has a very segregated school system. If you live in a small town where everybody is at or just above the median income and they all go to one of three different churches and vote Republican - well, that's who your classmates are. They'll all pray the same way you do, and their parents will vote the same way yours do, and so on. I don't know how to fix this.
Are there problems with homeschooling? Definitely. However, that just doesn't excuse making ridiculous strawmen.
I've come across this argument a few times before. Factually, it's bizarre. Emotionally, it's the anti-homeschool equivalent of "why did you even have kids if you were going to send them to daycare and let strangers raise them!!!!!" These people cannot be reasoned with and don't particularly want to be. They just want to be mean.
However, I'm sure most of us are a bit more familiar with daycare and brick-and-mortar schooling than with homeschooling, and might be taken in by a more calmly phrased variation on the first person's argument, so I'm making this post for your edification. Most of this is all pretty obvious if you sit down and think about it.
1. First things first, homeschooling is not an all-or-nothing proposition. It's common to homeschool for some years and not others, or to homeschool some children but not others, or both. It's very common for children to go to school for high school. And in areas that allow dual enrollment a great many children take classes at the public school while still being homeschooled.
2. Even while you're homeschooling, and even without dual enrollment, your child might take classes taught by somebody other than you. They might take "afterschool" programs, homeschool co-op classes, or online classes. Or they might have a private or semi-private tutor. These classes might be arranged to be primarily for socialization, or to offer enrichment, or to teach subjects which parents aren't comfortable handling themselves. Outside classes are extremely common.
Points one and two already show that not every homeschooler gets into it because they really hate the idea of somebody else teaching their precious babies. Actually, I've heard many reasons for homeschooling, including:
A. I want to include religion in the school day.
B. I want to make all my teaching connected to my religion!
C. There was too much religion in my local school.
D. My local school isn't very good academically.
E. My local school is dangerous or has a bullying problem.
F. I don't trust the public schools all that much.
G. My local school is adequate, but it wasn't a good fit for my child.
H. My child is gifted, and there wasn't enough differentiation.
I. My child has a disability, and there wasn't enough support.
J. My child is 2E, and there wasn't enough differentiation OR support.
K. My child would like to spend a lot of time focusing on a special interest (music, dance, herpetology), and it was either homeschool or not have a social life.
L. We live very far away from our school and honestly the commute was killing us.
M. We like to school in our PJs.
N. We move a lot, and I'd like my child's education to be more consistent.
O. My child asked to homeschool for reasons.
P. I specifically don't like the way our schools handle a particular issue.
Q. I would like all my children to graduate college by the time they're 19.
R. I believe in allowing my children a great deal of academic freedom ("unschooling").
S. I believe in allowing my children infinite academic freedom ("radical unschooling").
T. I want my child to have more free time to play with friends.
U. We have an illness/allergy situation and my child is safer at home.
V. One of us is probably not going to be around in five years, and while I still can I'd like to maximize our time together.
W. We have specific dietary rules my child has to follow, and during the earlier years it's easier to do that this way.
X. I'd like to do more trips and experiential learning than the schools generally provide, without sacrificing free time in the afternoons and weekends.
Now, I'm not going to claim that all these reasons are equal. However, "I don't think anybody can ever teach my child better than I can" is conspicuously not on the list. You sometimes see a variant of this - "I believe I'm the best teacher for the early years" - but even then....
3. Then we have two variations on the socialization argument. Either homeschool kids can't socialize, or they'll only socialize with people like them. Now, socialization is a real issue, and the careful homeschooling family makes sure to provide plenty of time with peers, ideally in both structured and unstructured activities.
However, it's worth noting that students in a classroom setting may not get much socialization time either if they don't have recess. I was told as a child, repeatedly, that my class was not in school to socialize but to learn. Careful questioning suggests that many parents and teachers are still rattling this off to students today... until the homeschool issue comes up, when classrooms are suddenly the only way to socialize.
And when socialization does happen in schools, there's no guarantee that those students are being exposed to a variety of views and experiences. The USA has a very segregated school system. If you live in a small town where everybody is at or just above the median income and they all go to one of three different churches and vote Republican - well, that's who your classmates are. They'll all pray the same way you do, and their parents will vote the same way yours do, and so on. I don't know how to fix this.
Are there problems with homeschooling? Definitely. However, that just doesn't excuse making ridiculous strawmen.
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no subject
Date: 2018-02-06 10:51 pm (UTC)Traditional public schools are actively anti-socialization; one I went to didn't even allow us to talk at the lunch tables.
"I don't know how to fix this."
I know a way, but there's no chance of it being tried in America this decade, if ever. I've long held that we need a National Service, not connected to the military in any way, mandatory for everybody for three years after they're out of high school. It would make good sense to send people out of their own communities, where they'd have to make new connections and learn different ways.
People always want to fight about the 'mandatory' part, but it would have to be mandatory for everyone - the billionaires' kids the same as the slum kids - or it would devolve into yet another bureaucratic burden on the poor, while the rich skated off to play like they do.
As for homeschooling: I'm totally in favor of all the flexibility, but the other side of that is, there has to be oversight as well - and if it was up to me, it would be Federal oversight, not State (or not primarily State, anyway.) People want to teach their kids religion, that's one thing, but they don't get to teach their kids nothing but religion. People want their kids to be 'unschooled'; fine, but the burden of proof ought to be on them, to demonstrate how that differs from simply being 'ignorant'.
That whole "we move a lot" thing raises a potential red flag. Some people move a lot because their kids keep racking up too many suspicious ER visits and/or calls to CPS from the neighbors. The Turpin family is just an extreme example of the 'Quiverfull' philosophy, that openly advocates child abuse as 'religious discipline', and puts a lot of emphasis on keeping children out of the view of secular authorities who might try and put a stop to it.
no subject
Date: 2018-02-06 11:03 pm (UTC)My rule of thumb is that done well, unschooling is waaaay more work for Mom and Dad than other options.
That whole "we move a lot" thing raises a potential red flag. Some people move a lot because their kids keep racking up too many suspicious ER visits and/or calls to CPS from the neighbors.
Yeah, I didn't include "We homeschool because actually we're child abusers" on that list, but it's definitely there. But many many families move a lot because they're in the military or because they want to travel the world (or the nation) or live on a boat or whatever and that's not necessarily bad.
no subject
Date: 2018-02-07 03:22 am (UTC)Yes, absolutely, and I have known one family that did it fairly well, but their situation was unusual: both parents highly-educated academics, both working at home (Dad mathemetician, Mom violin teacher,) in an extremely kid-safe, homeschool-friendly town.
I couldn't have done it; I was a single parent who had to work outside my home, and I didn't have the resources or the spoons even for homeschooling, let alone unschooling - nor did my daughter want either of those anyhow.
"But many many families move a lot because they're in the military..."
I was a Navy kid myself, and while homeschooling wasn't an option back in the day, I can't see that it would have been a good thing for those of us who frequently had to pull up stakes. If you move all the time and don't go to school, how do you meet other kids? They're all in school during the day. It's all very well to say "homeschooling groups", but it takes time to find those, and more time to assimilate, and they're not automatically going to be a good fit in whatever town you happen to be in.
Living on a boat is like living in a camper: it's not necessarily bad, and there can be some nice things about it, but it's certainly not ideal for children even at best, and that situation is usually not 'at best'. Here in the Pacific Northwest, where the winters are warm enough for people to live on boats year-round, they're known as "boat trash", which is mean, but not entirely unjustified. No doubt it's possible to do a creditable job of homeschooling while living on a boat, but I wouldn't call it 'probable'.
If it were up to me, all kids would have to be enrolled in an accredited school - not some jerry-rigged 'private school' like the Turpins set up - even if they never actually set foot in it, and would have a home visit at least every three months to check on their progress and welfare.