In other, somewhat less distressing news

[conuly]

AdBlock has updated so it's no longer usable the way I want to use it. Ugh.

***

The Usenet Deep Space Nine recapper who helped inspire modern TV criticism

Dark is divine: What colour are Indian gods and goddesses?

People Are Screaming After This Guy Mistakenly Thought The Women's March Was Cheering Him

A Year Ago, They Marched. Now a Record Number of Women Are Running for Office

Post-work: the radical idea of a world without jobs

The Brazilian man who lives in a sandcastle (Video)

Passing: I have to fight the battle on two fronts: gender and disability.

Too Much Music: A Failed Experiment In Dedicated Listening

The fabulous story of North Korea’s fabric made of stone

Mike Pence visits Middle East but US role as peace broker may be over

Before 'Roe v. Wade,' The Women of 'Jane' Provided Abortions For The Women Of Chicago

In The Midst Of #MeToo, What Type Of Man Do You Want To Be?

Cardinal rebukes pope over Chile 'slander' comments on abuse

How Do You Rebuild Your Life After Leaving A Polygamous Sect?

Forget About Siri and Alexa — When It Comes to Voice Identification, the “NSA Reigns Supreme”

A Child Abuse Prediction Model Fails Poor Families

Striking Florida Prisoners Thrown in Solitary Confinement, Activists Say

American Democracy Is an Easy Target

Poor minorities left behind in Indian cities boom

Putin cast as national saviour ahead of Russia election

The White House Has A New Voicemail Following The Government Shutdown And It's...Something (This isn't normal either fyi.)

The Good War: How America’s infatuation with World War II has eroded our conscience (That's a must read. I was immediately reminded of sholio's post about how our culture has more or less forgotten Vietnam. And while I was googling for that I found the next two links, so I guess this is a four-fer?)

Why Don’t Americans Know What Really Happened in Vietnam? Instead of confronting the truth, we scrubbed the record clean—and we’re still paying for it in Afghanistan and Iraq today.

The Vietnam War, as Seen by the Victors

Comments

[acelightning]

I remember the Vietnam War. I remember my male age-mates trying to avoid the draft, or failing to avoid the draft and coming home damaged in mind (like my then-boyfriend) and/or body... or coming home covered with a flag. I remember the nightly news on TV, filled with film and photos of Vietnamese people, often children, being rendered homeless, suffering horrible injuries, and experiencing unimaginably inhuman treatment at the hands of Americans who had been sent there (often against their will, of course) to "free" them. I remember marching in the street, chanting slogans and singing protest songs. I remember the astonishment we felt when our marching and singing ended the war, and forced a sitting President to resign before he could be impeached.

[conuly]

Maybe it'll happen again.

[acelightning]

I can still sing just as loud as I did fifty years ago!

[nodrog]

        These are the game-players and pathological liars of The Pentagon Papers,
        where an entire generation of smart, strong, skilled, loyal American
        soldiers were simply wasted by Washington policy wonks who were not
        interested in winning the war, but only in what would look good on their
        resumés.  These are the evil clowns who decided that the best response to
        9-11-01 was to invade Iraq (!) and to do so in the most ham-fisted idiotic
        way possible.  Now they're going to fill a new crop of body bags and VA
        wards…  and as always, lie about why it happened. 

        “And the beat goes on…”


The Pentagon Papers is truly worth reading.  Ol’ Bob MacNamara knew and admitted that there was no way to “win” in SE Asia; what they were doing was entirely for, and I quote, “domestic policy.”  As the saying went, “Don’t knock it - it’s the only war we’ve got.”

[conuly]

There's blood on his hands, then.

[nodrog]

        I can say - not as a patriotic bromide, but with full knowledge of the
        necessary metaphysical, epistemological, ethical, political and esthetic
        roots - that the United States of America is the greatest, the noblest and,
        in its original founding principles, the only moral country in the history
        of the world.

        - Ayn Rand


Its government, however, ain't no such a thing.  Beyond the framework of necessary laws, coining of money and so forth, everything the United States achieved, that caused them to “sit bestride the world like a Colossus,” was achieved away from and in spite of Federal bureaucrats.

“For every action there is an equal and opposite government program.” - Joe-Bob Briggs

[conuly]

that the United States of America is the greatest, the noblest and, in its original founding principles, the only moral country in the history of the world.

If you overlook the slavery which was explicitly protected in the Constitution, maybe. And the fact that a non-zero number of our Founding Fathers actively participated in genocide.

[nodrog]

a non-zero number of our Founding Fathers

Interesting.  Name two.

(Andrew Jackson doesn't count as a Founding Father; he was ten years old at the time.)


UTA:  Then perhaps you could tell me where these exploits are mentioned in the US Constitution - which is the actual subject of discussion - or how they affected it.  If it's important enough to mention as a counter-argument, you should be able to say how…

[conuly]

George Washington, Village Destroyer. That's one, a non-zero number. And many of the other prominent ones, such as Jefferson (that's two) were whole-heartedly for warfare or forced removal to help white people.

When the actions of our young nation involved slavery (enshrined in the Constitution, something you haven't addressed) and genocide and forced relocations, it's hard to say that it has any claims towards superior morality. Actions, as they say, speak louder than words.

Given that one of the few things Ayn Rand and I see eye to eye on is that racism is bad, you'd think she'd condemn those actions.

[acelightning]

I read The Pentagon Papers when it first came out. I'm completely aware of the type of "leadership" that believes the US has to always be in a war of some kind, because otherwise how would the voters know who the "enemy" is?

This is just one of the many, many things that have been taken for granted for so long that very few people even think there's anything wrong with them. All such things - malignant monotheism, racism, casual sexual abuse, the two-party system, even capitalism itself, just to name a few - need to be changed... but how in the name of humanity are we going to accomplish that?

“The Discovery of Freedom”

[nodrog]

… And why is the attempted “cure” for these ills always, always horribly worse than the disease?

“A strong conviction that something must be done is the parent of many bad measures.” - Daniel Webster


How's your learning curve?


        Why did men die of hunger, for six thousand years?

        Why did they walk, and carry goods and other men on their backs, for six thousand years, and suddenly,
        in one century, only on a sixth of this earth's surface, they make steamships, railroads, motors,
        airplanes, and now are flying around the earth in its utmost heights of air?

        Why did families live six thousand years in floorless hovels, without windows or chimneys, then, in
        eighty years and only in these United States, they are taking floors, chimneys, glass windows for
        granted, and regarding electric lights, porcelain toilets, and window screens as minimum necessities?

        Why did workers walk barefoot, in rags, with lousy hair and unwashed teeth, and workingmen wear no
        pants, for six thousand years, and here--in less than a century--silk stockings, lip sticks, permanent
        waves, sweaters, overcoats, shaving cream, safety razors. It's incredible.

        For thousands of years, human beings use their energies in unsuccessful efforts to get wretched
        shelter and meager food. Then on one small part of the earth, a few men use their energies so
        effectively that three generations create a completely new world.

        What explains this?


    In 1943, Rose Wilder Lane sought to highlight the difference it made in America that the individual
    was permitted freedom from government authority. The Americans broke from the idea that dominated all
    over human history that they must depend on some overarching authority in government to grant them
    well being, and thus when good happens, we owe ever more to the powers that be.

    The one idea that this is not the case, that human beings have within themselves the capacity to make
    their own way, she wrote, created the most glorious civilization in world history. Her passion was to
    help others see the cause: not authority but individual initiative and action.

    She traced out this idea to provide sketches of history from the ancient world to the mid-20th
    century, believing that she had discovered the answer to what transformed the world from a dark,
    miserable, sickly, and dangerous place to one where humans thrive and create. She further condemned
    all political trends of her time from Fascism, to Communism, to the New Deal…

    Her prose is stark and strong, the product of decades of experience in attempting to get readers to
    listen, and succeeding…


    Her love of America has nothing to do with the jingoism we know all too well. It is a love of
    individualism, experimentation, risk, entrepreneurship, creativity, reward, and the inspiration that
    comes with building a new civilization itself. What a hymn to our history she writes!

    And note the date. This was written in wartime. There were censorship rules at the time, things you
    could and couldn’t say. What might she have written about war authoritarianism that she did not dare
    to write? I think we can imagine. In fact, you can read between the lines. She saw America betraying
    its history, principles, and destiny. And what would she write today?



http://www.liwfrontiergirl.com/discovery.pdf


Most people who say, “This will change your mind,” really mean, “Give me your mind.”  If you read this - or even skim it! - you'll see the difference:  It's your mind, even if you've been told otherwise.

Re: “The Discovery of Freedom”

[conuly]

Tangent, Rose Wilder Lane was a horrible person and raging narcissist.

Re: “The Discovery of Freedom”

[nodrog]

        Ad hominem (Latin for "to the man" or "to the person"[1]), short for argumentum ad
        hominem, is a fallacious argumentative strategy whereby an argument is rebutted by attacking the
        character, motive, or other attribute of the person making the argument, or persons associated with
        the argument, rather than attacking the substance of the argument itself[2]…

        - Wikipedia


Was that your best shot?

Re: “The Discovery of Freedom”

[conuly]

She was a pathological liar. She might be right, but I'm not gonna wade through her BS to figure it out.

[conuly]

Mass revolution? But I can't guarantee things will be better. Different, maybe.

[acelightning]

Well, "#MeToo" is having a profound effect, over a very short time, towards uprooting toxic attitudes - attitudes that have been so deeply ingrained in our culture for so long that most people (especially men!) hardly even thought about them as anything but "that's just the way things are". Gotta start somewhere!

[conuly]

Let's see if it has a long-term effect. I'm worried about the backlash.

[acelightning]

I'm surprised I haven't heard of any backlash yet. I suspect that at least some of that is due to the original point of #MeToo - that there really is strength in numbers.

[wpadmirer]

I own THE PENTAGON PAPERS and have read it, plus I read the releases at the time. It's disgusting that powerful, wealthy people use American lives as fodder to pad their bank accounts and resumes.

Cheney made a fortune off the Iraq War.