AAAARRRRGGGGHHH!

[conuly]

My god! You just can't get away from this sort of silliness!

So I leave autism's insane discussion. It's not profitable to hang around there anymore. Losing my soul, I was!

And I meander over to brits_americans to visit the Thanksgiving discussion. And it's there! Again! GAH!

Sometimes, I could just scream. The universe is most assuredly out to get me.

Comments

[moggymania.livejournal.com]

Something funny-odd but perhaps meaningful related to that discussion... I grew up in an area that has/had really strong "Native American" influence in terms of descendants, tribal members, valley names, and so forth. However, until adulthood I had the odd idea that "Native/American/Indian" referred to some other nebulous historical group totally unrelated to the Miwok, Lakota, Cherokee, etc. I'd been hearing about for so long.

[fjorab-teke.livejournal.com]

Ever since I learned about the term "Native American" and started feeling less awkward saying it, that's the term I've used for the people whose (majority of) ancestors lived here before European colonists arrived.

The reason? They're from America. They're not from India. It's less confusing to me, since I know people who have moved to the USA from India...and are thus "American Indians" I would suppose. :-p

Blame it on Columbus! X-D

[innerbrat]

To me, 'native' means 'born and/or raised there' as opposed to being a migratory citizen. So you, Connie, are as far as I know, a native American, as much as I am a native Briton. Using the term for people of a certain ethnic origin seems comfortably over-PC, and I abhor the American insistence of calling themselves hyphen-Americans (Native-Americans, African-Americans, Italian-Americans, Irish-Americans, I hate it.)

'Indian' to me means someone from India, either in terms of citizenship or ethnic origin.

The term I use for those people who've been on the North American continent longer than the Caucasians is "Amerindian", which I picked up in Anthropology.

[eofs.livejournal.com]

Ditto to all this.

I had a teacher who made us say "the indigenous peoples of North America" which is kinda long...

[maladaptive.livejournal.com]

I believe Amerind is being used now?

[conuly]

That's another term imposed top-down. I don't have the slightest clue what people Of That Ethnic Group think on the subject, either individually or as a group.

[wakasplat.livejournal.com]

Most I've known just said Indian or their specific tribe. <shrug>

A comment by Sherman Alexie in this article (http://www.fallsapart.com/art-lat.html):

While they're busy keeping Diamond Phillips off casting lists, Hollywood types also would be wise to avoid calling Alexie a "Native American." The author dismisses the term as meaningless, a product of liberal white guilt.

"I'm an Indian," he says. "I'll only use 'Native American' in mixed company.

[conuly]

I'm somewhat mollified to note that the person I'm talking with is Native American (her term, her rules), but that doesn't change the fact that not everybody who fits in that really broad category agrees with her, despite her earlier claims to the contrary.

[ancarett]

I understand -- there are some days when people weighing in on things such as this just drives me insane!

[caprinus.livejournal.com]

As a Person of Pinkness with Primarily Caucasoid Characteristics and Fatness and Long Hair I am incredibly offended! LOL

You do a good job presiding over the Internets conuly, don't let them grind you down.

[conuly]

Bastardes. All of 'em.

[maladaptive.livejournal.com]

G'lawd, but person first language is ridonkulous!

Don't these people understand how STUPID it sounds? It works for some things-- I'm a woman with ADHD-- but I am not a woman with Cubanness. I am a Cuban woman. The "you just don't want to change the language" argument makes me want to scream. No, you don't get to change a language because it makes you feel more PC.

It really is possible to be too PC.

[conuly]

Don't these people understand how STUPID it sounds?

Apparently not. I agree, it should be used for terms that aren't adjectives. Special needs, for example, is not an adjective - you can't be a special needs student. You have to be a student with special needs. You can't be a wheelchair passenger, you are a passenger in a wheelchair*.

*_{But, saying "If you are a passenger who uses a wheelchair" three times in an announcement over the PA, that's absurd. Try "If you use a wheelchair..." instead, thanks. They all know they're passengers already.}

[rainbow-goddess.livejournal.com]

In Canada, the preferred term is "first nations." Some people use "aboriginal." Some use "native," but as another commenter pointed out, "native" can apply to anyone who was born here.

Generally, I leave it up to the person. If he or she wants to be called an "Indian," then I'll call them an "Indian." If they prefer "first nations," then I'll call them that. Most, however, seem to prefer to use the name of the nation or band they belong to. "I am a member of the Haida nation," for example.

[conuly]

Generally, I leave it up to the person.

Oh, definitely - that's the only acceptable route.

Most, however, seem to prefer to use the name of the nation or band they belong to. "I am a member of the Haida nation," for example.

That's been my (rather limited, I admit) experience as well.

[moggymania.livejournal.com]

Something funny-odd but perhaps meaningful related to that discussion... I grew up in an area that has/had really strong "Native American" influence in terms of descendants, tribal members, valley names, and so forth. However, until adulthood I had the odd idea that "Native/American/Indian" referred to some other nebulous historical group totally unrelated to the Miwok, Lakota, Cherokee, etc. I'd been hearing about for so long.

[fjorab-teke.livejournal.com]

Ever since I learned about the term "Native American" and started feeling less awkward saying it, that's the term I've used for the people whose (majority of) ancestors lived here before European colonists arrived.

The reason? They're from America. They're not from India. It's less confusing to me, since I know people who have moved to the USA from India...and are thus "American Indians" I would suppose. :-p

Blame it on Columbus! X-D

[innerbrat]

To me, 'native' means 'born and/or raised there' as opposed to being a migratory citizen. So you, Connie, are as far as I know, a native American, as much as I am a native Briton. Using the term for people of a certain ethnic origin seems comfortably over-PC, and I abhor the American insistence of calling themselves hyphen-Americans (Native-Americans, African-Americans, Italian-Americans, Irish-Americans, I hate it.)

'Indian' to me means someone from India, either in terms of citizenship or ethnic origin.

The term I use for those people who've been on the North American continent longer than the Caucasians is "Amerindian", which I picked up in Anthropology.

[eofs.livejournal.com]

Ditto to all this.

I had a teacher who made us say "the indigenous peoples of North America" which is kinda long...

[maladaptive.livejournal.com]

I believe Amerind is being used now?

[conuly]

That's another term imposed top-down. I don't have the slightest clue what people Of That Ethnic Group think on the subject, either individually or as a group.

[wakasplat.livejournal.com]

Most I've known just said Indian or their specific tribe. <shrug>

A comment by Sherman Alexie in this article (http://www.fallsapart.com/art-lat.html):

While they're busy keeping Diamond Phillips off casting lists, Hollywood types also would be wise to avoid calling Alexie a "Native American." The author dismisses the term as meaningless, a product of liberal white guilt.

"I'm an Indian," he says. "I'll only use 'Native American' in mixed company.

[conuly]

I'm somewhat mollified to note that the person I'm talking with is Native American (her term, her rules), but that doesn't change the fact that not everybody who fits in that really broad category agrees with her, despite her earlier claims to the contrary.

[ancarett]

I understand -- there are some days when people weighing in on things such as this just drives me insane!

[caprinus.livejournal.com]

As a Person of Pinkness with Primarily Caucasoid Characteristics and Fatness and Long Hair I am incredibly offended! LOL

You do a good job presiding over the Internets conuly, don't let them grind you down.

[conuly]

Bastardes. All of 'em.

[maladaptive.livejournal.com]

G'lawd, but person first language is ridonkulous!

Don't these people understand how STUPID it sounds? It works for some things-- I'm a woman with ADHD-- but I am not a woman with Cubanness. I am a Cuban woman. The "you just don't want to change the language" argument makes me want to scream. No, you don't get to change a language because it makes you feel more PC.

It really is possible to be too PC.

[conuly]

Don't these people understand how STUPID it sounds?

Apparently not. I agree, it should be used for terms that aren't adjectives. Special needs, for example, is not an adjective - you can't be a special needs student. You have to be a student with special needs. You can't be a wheelchair passenger, you are a passenger in a wheelchair*.

*_{But, saying "If you are a passenger who uses a wheelchair" three times in an announcement over the PA, that's absurd. Try "If you use a wheelchair..." instead, thanks. They all know they're passengers already.}

[rainbow-goddess.livejournal.com]

In Canada, the preferred term is "first nations." Some people use "aboriginal." Some use "native," but as another commenter pointed out, "native" can apply to anyone who was born here.

Generally, I leave it up to the person. If he or she wants to be called an "Indian," then I'll call them an "Indian." If they prefer "first nations," then I'll call them that. Most, however, seem to prefer to use the name of the nation or band they belong to. "I am a member of the Haida nation," for example.

[conuly]

Generally, I leave it up to the person.

Oh, definitely - that's the only acceptable route.

Most, however, seem to prefer to use the name of the nation or band they belong to. "I am a member of the Haida nation," for example.

That's been my (rather limited, I admit) experience as well.