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conuly
You remember this post, right?
Well, while I'm talking there, I'm also reading my Friends page, and I find two more links discussing the original post (the one I had linked to)!
Here and here.
Y'know, I remember reading Harriet the Spy. Decent book, though I always had a few issues with it... Anyway, I never thought of any of the characters as particularily gay or anything. And certainly, I know people who say they knew they were 'different' before they even knew how...
Imagine my surprise to find out that this interpretation is especially common. A quick google search will show people proving this six ways from Sunday.
I've read some of Fitzhugh's other books, I can see she was apparently gay, I can see that this interpretation might be the 'correct' one. But we don't know, do we? As near as I can tell, nobody outright asked her, did they? Maybe there wasn't supposed to be any gay or straight or anything in those books, and people who see that are wrong, forcing their views onto her books.
Maybe.
Or maybe not. Maybe that's what she intended after all. Maybe, regardless of the words on the paper, regardless of our perceptions, the only thing that makes a view valid or not is what she was thinking as she wrote it.
I've told you all about Robert Frost, who said that when he wrote a poem about taking a walk in the woods, he was talking about taking a walk in the woods. No subtext, no meaning, that's all you got. But people still interpret his words to mean all sorts of things. People do that to everything. When I was in the 8th grade, we read Julius Caesar. We spent days on the concept that "Caesar died because of his pride". Personally, I don't think Shakespeare thought all that hard about his plays, I think he was more interested in filling his stomach, but that's beside the point. When I was asked "Why did Caesar die?" I answered (more as a joke than anything else) that he died because it was his fate.
The lectures that ensued were not to be believed. My interpretation of the text was not correct. But... I don't know. I suspect that many of the people watching that play as it was first performed would have had the exact same answer as I did. Comets, entrails, mad old soothsayers - it's obvious, isn't it? Why was my view wrong? It was exactly what was in the text!
When I read Harry Potter (you knew I'd return to this eventually!), there's a character, Luna, who seems very aspie to me. (Once read a fic (a gen fic, indeed!) where that's how she was written. The fic sucked, but I read it anyway because I loved that view of Luna inside her own mind.) Of course, she's not explicitly identified as being on the spectrum, and we don't see that much of her anyway. Maybe she's "not supposed to be", maybe I'm all wrong. But if I go, and I write an essay about how she's so clearly autistic, I suspect nobody will yell at me. I imagine I'll be able to present that wherever I like (including street corners), and that people will smile, nod, and discuss it - an interesting viewpoint!
I don't actually care about the nonexistant sex lives in Harry Potter. Sure, I'll read fic of all sorts, and I'm happy to discuss it, but - truth is, when it comes to specific issues, I'll take a side just for the fun of arguing it.
I do care that people who look at the books and see something in them that I don't can do that. If they see that Harry's obsession with Draco is really just sublimated (I don't, though I'll say I do for the fun of it), why is that more upsetting than my view that Luna's on the spectrum? If I argue that the twins are bullies, some will disagree, but nobody says that I'm forcing JKR to write to suit my interests.
It's all very confusing.
Anyway, the links aren't that related to this post, but this post is related to my ongoing discussion in the comments of my last entry on the subject. Kinda.
Edit: Also, if anybody has any links to any non-shippy/slashy fics, or interesting discussions, please to post them? I need to renew somebody's faith in humanity over here.
Well, while I'm talking there, I'm also reading my Friends page, and I find two more links discussing the original post (the one I had linked to)!
Here and here.
Y'know, I remember reading Harriet the Spy. Decent book, though I always had a few issues with it... Anyway, I never thought of any of the characters as particularily gay or anything. And certainly, I know people who say they knew they were 'different' before they even knew how...
Imagine my surprise to find out that this interpretation is especially common. A quick google search will show people proving this six ways from Sunday.
I've read some of Fitzhugh's other books, I can see she was apparently gay, I can see that this interpretation might be the 'correct' one. But we don't know, do we? As near as I can tell, nobody outright asked her, did they? Maybe there wasn't supposed to be any gay or straight or anything in those books, and people who see that are wrong, forcing their views onto her books.
Maybe.
Or maybe not. Maybe that's what she intended after all. Maybe, regardless of the words on the paper, regardless of our perceptions, the only thing that makes a view valid or not is what she was thinking as she wrote it.
I've told you all about Robert Frost, who said that when he wrote a poem about taking a walk in the woods, he was talking about taking a walk in the woods. No subtext, no meaning, that's all you got. But people still interpret his words to mean all sorts of things. People do that to everything. When I was in the 8th grade, we read Julius Caesar. We spent days on the concept that "Caesar died because of his pride". Personally, I don't think Shakespeare thought all that hard about his plays, I think he was more interested in filling his stomach, but that's beside the point. When I was asked "Why did Caesar die?" I answered (more as a joke than anything else) that he died because it was his fate.
The lectures that ensued were not to be believed. My interpretation of the text was not correct. But... I don't know. I suspect that many of the people watching that play as it was first performed would have had the exact same answer as I did. Comets, entrails, mad old soothsayers - it's obvious, isn't it? Why was my view wrong? It was exactly what was in the text!
When I read Harry Potter (you knew I'd return to this eventually!), there's a character, Luna, who seems very aspie to me. (Once read a fic (a gen fic, indeed!) where that's how she was written. The fic sucked, but I read it anyway because I loved that view of Luna inside her own mind.) Of course, she's not explicitly identified as being on the spectrum, and we don't see that much of her anyway. Maybe she's "not supposed to be", maybe I'm all wrong. But if I go, and I write an essay about how she's so clearly autistic, I suspect nobody will yell at me. I imagine I'll be able to present that wherever I like (including street corners), and that people will smile, nod, and discuss it - an interesting viewpoint!
I don't actually care about the nonexistant sex lives in Harry Potter. Sure, I'll read fic of all sorts, and I'm happy to discuss it, but - truth is, when it comes to specific issues, I'll take a side just for the fun of arguing it.
I do care that people who look at the books and see something in them that I don't can do that. If they see that Harry's obsession with Draco is really just sublimated (I don't, though I'll say I do for the fun of it), why is that more upsetting than my view that Luna's on the spectrum? If I argue that the twins are bullies, some will disagree, but nobody says that I'm forcing JKR to write to suit my interests.
It's all very confusing.
Anyway, the links aren't that related to this post, but this post is related to my ongoing discussion in the comments of my last entry on the subject. Kinda.
Edit: Also, if anybody has any links to any non-shippy/slashy fics, or interesting discussions, please to post them? I need to renew somebody's faith in humanity over here.
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no subject
Date: 2005-08-08 01:47 pm (UTC)From my understanding, at its core queer theory isn't explicitly about sexuality- it's about society's need to pigeonhole everything into tidy little categories, to divide the world into ingroup and outgroup. It's about being "other", whether your intersexed, gay, autistic, or otherwise marked as "different". The way Lupin is treated by others for being a werewolf is a perfect application of queer theory, whether or not it was meant to be "about" homosexuality or not..
In any case, I wholeheartedly agree with you about authorial intent vs. reader response- if I ever write anything and get a lot of people reading it, I'll be really interested to see all the interpretations I'd get. I think that's why I like retellings and reinterpretations of classical themes. I love that sort of discussion already- it's really fascinating looking at all the different views people can take on the same story.
I'd love to give fic links, but I tend to stay as far away from HP fandom as I can because it's so frothing insane most of the time. Meanwhile... I'd really like to see that Luna fic, too, even if it's not particularly well written.
no subject
Date: 2005-08-09 01:46 am (UTC)