Truly absurd.

[conuly]

Red isn't stressful unless you make it stressful - and if you're worried about getting a bad grade, the color it's written in won't matter.

Comments

[leora.livejournal.com]

I am almost tempted to use a font tag to reply in color... but no, I will spare you.

The problem is not the kids afraid of getting a bad grade anyway, it's the ones who aren't.

[conuly]

Hey, completely offtopic, but did you know your style messes with the mousegestures extension on firefox? In order to open things in new tabs and whatnot, I have to hit ctrl along with my right click.

[conuly]

Make that "easygestures" extension.

[leora.livejournal.com]

No.. I didn't. And I think I also unfairly judged firefox...

hmmm, my style is only a very, very slightly modified version of the default style it's based on. It's not a custom style. It's umm clean and simple, I think, but with a modified number of entries per page. So, I think the problem is with the LJ style itself. You may want to test that and let the styles admins know so they can file a bug.

[conuly]

It really might be the extension, except that your journal is the only place I've encountered this problem.

What do you mean, "unfairly judged firefox"?

How do I test that? Can't I just send in a support request without testing?

[leora.livejournal.com]

I think my lothario considered switching me over to firefox, we tried it out. I saw it didn't work right with tabbed browsing, so we didn't switch me over. But if it was my style that was broken (and I probably did test it out on my LJ) then it wasn't the version of FireFox I had that was the problem.

How to test it - toss a test journal into magazine (I just looked it up, and magazine is the style I use) and don't add any modifications or whatnot and see if your browser works with that or not. If it does, it's my customizations, if it doesn't, it's the style.

[conuly]

Tabs may be working now anyway, if that really was the problem. You may wish to try it again.

[leora.livejournal.com]

Or method b) bug a supporthelp of your choice. I'd choose you. :)

[conuly]

Aw, thanks. But I'm not a styles-y person, supporthelp or otherwise. And I'm certainly not bugging myself, that's silly.

[conuly]

It's definitely the style. Hold on, making a post.

[leora.livejournal.com]

This should work as a temporary solution.

[kibbles.livejournal.com]

For years schools round here have been using post it notes, in district 21 and 22.

[xandiwillflailx.livejournal.com]

thats ridiculous, you're right. ive had teachers use red ink, blue, black, green, purple, and sparkly (my favorite) but a bad comment is a bad comment, no matter what color. :)

I feel like I keep having this conversation

[mortaine.livejournal.com]

Actually, color theory indicates that red *is* more stressfull than other colors-- it's one of the two colors that we see with our reptile brains, and humans have a very primitive response of excitement to red.

Which doesn't mean that it's a bad color. But years of red=corrections has taught students that red=bad. If you want to reach students, hit them with a color they won't immediately turn away from or be afraid of.

I know it sounds stupid, but.... I do think my students were more responsive because I used purple ink than they would have been if I'd used red.

Re: I feel like I keep having this conversation

[conuly]

Except eventually, don't you end up with a generation of students which flinches at the colors purple and teal?

Re: I feel like I keep having this conversation

[mortaine.livejournal.com]

Not precisely. Because red is traditional, so pretty much ALL teachers used red. That's 100%. None used other colors.

If you had 6 teachers in school, you would get red ink from 6 of them.

If, however, all of your teachers picked any ink color except black or pencil, then you would get teal ink (for instance) from 1 out of 6 of them. That's 1/6 exposure to negative comments in teal, vs. 6/6 exposure to negative comments in red, previously. As a result, students will not have as strong of an association between the color and the negative comments.

It's like training a dog. If you wave a white flag at a dog and then hit it with a stick, the dog will quickly learn that white flag=bad. It takes about 5 times as many positive reinforcements as negative to override the negative connotation of a negative reinforcer, so if you praise a student four times in a paper and then give them one critical remark, they will remember the critical remark more (this is common knowledge in dog and people training-- be sparing with the negatives). Anything can be a negative reinforcer, and unwittingly, generations of teachers have made red ink into that reinforcer.

The only purpose of the color is to call attention to the thing that was written by the teacher, not the student. If the student gets trained that red=bad, then they will avoid seeing the red ink entirely, just as a dog will pretend not to see its owner standing there when it's trying to get away with some bad behavior.

If the student gets bad comments in every color of ink, then the student's mind will have to find another negative reinforcer, like "it's in handwriting" or "it's in the margins" or, best still, "it has a D at the top of the page."

Re: I feel like I keep having this conversation

[leora.livejournal.com]

Yes, except that assumes that all comments by a teacher are negative, when they're not. So, if all teachers grade in red, you get both good and bad comments in red. Both good and bad grades in red.

Re: I feel like I keep having this conversation

[mortaine.livejournal.com]

As I said-- the negative feedback has more impact than the positive, so teachers who provide an equal amount of positive and negative comments will be perceived by their students as very critical.

[ladytalon.livejournal.com]

I grade in red because it means I don't have to switch pens. Because some students write in green; some write in purple; some write in blue; some use pencils. And so on. No one uses red because everyone knows that the teacher uses it. I like my writing to be distinct from their own; that way, they can glance through and read corrections.

Also, I teach college students, so I'd hope they're past having an instinctual response to red that actually causes them harm in some way.

[lakidaa.livejournal.com]

That's just silly.

Now, if only they could make teachers write legibly...

(I <3 my english teacher; he is awesome, but I can't read his handwriting.)

[leora.livejournal.com]

I am almost tempted to use a font tag to reply in color... but no, I will spare you.

The problem is not the kids afraid of getting a bad grade anyway, it's the ones who aren't.

[conuly]

Hey, completely offtopic, but did you know your style messes with the mousegestures extension on firefox? In order to open things in new tabs and whatnot, I have to hit ctrl along with my right click.

[conuly]

Make that "easygestures" extension.

[leora.livejournal.com]

No.. I didn't. And I think I also unfairly judged firefox...

hmmm, my style is only a very, very slightly modified version of the default style it's based on. It's not a custom style. It's umm clean and simple, I think, but with a modified number of entries per page. So, I think the problem is with the LJ style itself. You may want to test that and let the styles admins know so they can file a bug.

[conuly]

It really might be the extension, except that your journal is the only place I've encountered this problem.

What do you mean, "unfairly judged firefox"?

How do I test that? Can't I just send in a support request without testing?

[leora.livejournal.com]

I think my lothario considered switching me over to firefox, we tried it out. I saw it didn't work right with tabbed browsing, so we didn't switch me over. But if it was my style that was broken (and I probably did test it out on my LJ) then it wasn't the version of FireFox I had that was the problem.

How to test it - toss a test journal into magazine (I just looked it up, and magazine is the style I use) and don't add any modifications or whatnot and see if your browser works with that or not. If it does, it's my customizations, if it doesn't, it's the style.

[conuly]

Tabs may be working now anyway, if that really was the problem. You may wish to try it again.

[leora.livejournal.com]

Or method b) bug a supporthelp of your choice. I'd choose you. :)

[conuly]

Aw, thanks. But I'm not a styles-y person, supporthelp or otherwise. And I'm certainly not bugging myself, that's silly.

[conuly]

It's definitely the style. Hold on, making a post.

[leora.livejournal.com]

This should work as a temporary solution.

[kibbles.livejournal.com]

For years schools round here have been using post it notes, in district 21 and 22.

[xandiwillflailx.livejournal.com]

thats ridiculous, you're right. ive had teachers use red ink, blue, black, green, purple, and sparkly (my favorite) but a bad comment is a bad comment, no matter what color. :)

I feel like I keep having this conversation

[mortaine.livejournal.com]

Actually, color theory indicates that red *is* more stressfull than other colors-- it's one of the two colors that we see with our reptile brains, and humans have a very primitive response of excitement to red.

Which doesn't mean that it's a bad color. But years of red=corrections has taught students that red=bad. If you want to reach students, hit them with a color they won't immediately turn away from or be afraid of.

I know it sounds stupid, but.... I do think my students were more responsive because I used purple ink than they would have been if I'd used red.

Re: I feel like I keep having this conversation

[conuly]

Except eventually, don't you end up with a generation of students which flinches at the colors purple and teal?

Re: I feel like I keep having this conversation

[mortaine.livejournal.com]

Not precisely. Because red is traditional, so pretty much ALL teachers used red. That's 100%. None used other colors.

If you had 6 teachers in school, you would get red ink from 6 of them.

If, however, all of your teachers picked any ink color except black or pencil, then you would get teal ink (for instance) from 1 out of 6 of them. That's 1/6 exposure to negative comments in teal, vs. 6/6 exposure to negative comments in red, previously. As a result, students will not have as strong of an association between the color and the negative comments.

It's like training a dog. If you wave a white flag at a dog and then hit it with a stick, the dog will quickly learn that white flag=bad. It takes about 5 times as many positive reinforcements as negative to override the negative connotation of a negative reinforcer, so if you praise a student four times in a paper and then give them one critical remark, they will remember the critical remark more (this is common knowledge in dog and people training-- be sparing with the negatives). Anything can be a negative reinforcer, and unwittingly, generations of teachers have made red ink into that reinforcer.

The only purpose of the color is to call attention to the thing that was written by the teacher, not the student. If the student gets trained that red=bad, then they will avoid seeing the red ink entirely, just as a dog will pretend not to see its owner standing there when it's trying to get away with some bad behavior.

If the student gets bad comments in every color of ink, then the student's mind will have to find another negative reinforcer, like "it's in handwriting" or "it's in the margins" or, best still, "it has a D at the top of the page."

Re: I feel like I keep having this conversation

[leora.livejournal.com]

Yes, except that assumes that all comments by a teacher are negative, when they're not. So, if all teachers grade in red, you get both good and bad comments in red. Both good and bad grades in red.

Re: I feel like I keep having this conversation

[mortaine.livejournal.com]

As I said-- the negative feedback has more impact than the positive, so teachers who provide an equal amount of positive and negative comments will be perceived by their students as very critical.

[ladytalon.livejournal.com]

I grade in red because it means I don't have to switch pens. Because some students write in green; some write in purple; some write in blue; some use pencils. And so on. No one uses red because everyone knows that the teacher uses it. I like my writing to be distinct from their own; that way, they can glance through and read corrections.

Also, I teach college students, so I'd hope they're past having an instinctual response to red that actually causes them harm in some way.

[lakidaa.livejournal.com]

That's just silly.

Now, if only they could make teachers write legibly...

(I <3 my english teacher; he is awesome, but I can't read his handwriting.)