*sigh*

[conuly]

You can reject IQ as a measure of intelligence just because you dislike the Flynn effect. Or you can say that lower IQ scores among mothers prove that stupid people are outbreeding smart people. What you can't do is try to use both those arguments simultaneously. If you can't see why this is a bad idea, then you really need to excuse yourself from any conversation that even remotely touches on the subject of intelligence.

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Comments

[elenbarathi.livejournal.com]

Hmmm. I don't dislike the Flynn effect - I think it's been pretty adequately explained - but I do reject IQ scores as a measure of 'intelligence', because what IQ tests actually measure is the ability to take IQ tests, which is only one kind of intelligence.

There's no doubt that poorer, less-educated people tend to start breeding earlier, and to have more children, than richer, better-educated people. But wealth and education aren't indicators of intelligence; they're just indicators of social class.

[conuly]

Hmmm. I don't dislike the Flynn effect - I think it's been pretty adequately explained - but I do reject IQ scores as a measure of 'intelligence', because what IQ tests actually measure is the ability to take IQ tests, which is only one kind of intelligence.

Which is a perfectly valid perspective.

There's no doubt that poorer, less-educated people tend to start breeding earlier, and to have more children, than richer, better-educated people. But wealth and education aren't indicators of intelligence; they're just indicators of social class.

I tried explaining that to this dude, but does he listen? I'm just taking internal bets with myself on how long it's going to be before he advocates flat-out eugenics. (And this on a Star Trek forum, too! I despair, really. I like to imagine everybody who likes the same shows I like is good and sensible, but look where that gets me*!)


* I like to imagine the same thing about atheists and cat lovers as well, but you know, the most famous atheist cat lover I can think of was Ayn Rand, so maybe I should quit this approach to life.

[elenbarathi.livejournal.com]

Heh, advocating eugenics on a Star Trek forum?!? "KHAAAANNN!!!"

If you want to poke this guy with a pointy stick, you could comment that since 'survival of the fittest' is all about who has the most grandchildren, this must show that the 'lower class' is more adaptive, partially due to to hybrid vigor (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heterosis), and partly because the harsher circumstances in which they live weed out the weak among them more effectively.

Hybrid vigor is my answer to advocates of eugenics and/or so-called 'racial purity' (a scientifically invalid concept.) If we as a species wish to survive, it's essential that we drastically reduce our population while preserving as much of our genetic diversity as possible.

I don't hold with either forbidding or compelling anyone to breed or not to breed. However, if both sterilization and long-term birth control were free and easily accessible, a lot of people would avail themselves of them voluntarily. And if getting one's tubes tied after the first or second pregnancy earned a big fat bonus, a lot of women would take that option. If not enough? simply up the ante.

I've known a number of cat-lovers who are assholes, and several atheists who are as well. I think Richard Dawkins is right about a lot of things, but unfortunately he seems convinced that he's right about everything.

As for Ayn Rand, like every other young intellectual in the 70's, I read Atlas Shrugged, and.... WTF?!? The only reason I made it through that over-written tome at all was because I was so suffused with outrage that I had to keep reading to see what worse was to come. What a waste of wood-pulp!