You guys see this yet?

[conuly]

Mother seeks girl's hysterectomy (didn't we do this last year?)

And here's another entry on the subject.

Another article, "Keep my daughter a child". They're not even trying to be subtle with that one. The bit on her not being able to ride horses anymore bothers me - Google is suggesting that ramps to help people in wheelchairs mount horses aren't even all that expensive.

Comments

[bookgirlwa.livejournal.com]

Ah, jeez - on clicking on the Feminist LJ link I've just reminded myself *why* I no longer read that community. `CP sufferers' WTF!!!!

And why *shouldn't* we judge what parents do - sometimes parents do terrible things to their kids, even when they say how much they love them!!! Parents can have the same set of ablist assumptions and prejudice as the rest of society.

And I really really really do know what I'm talking about as far as that goes. My parents treated me like shit, and never had my best interests at heart a day in their lives, meanwhile getting all kinds of credit from the world for having a disabled child.

('scuse the rant - the Feminist comments just pissed me off, serves me right for clicking)

[latenightparty.livejournal.com]

Yeah. There are some truly horrible parents out there--mean, selfish, or just plain idiotic. So I do not agree that "parents know what's best for their children." Because often, they don't.

[conuly]

And why *shouldn't* we judge what parents do - sometimes parents do terrible things to their kids, even when they say how much they love them!!! Parents can have the same set of ablist assumptions and prejudice as the rest of society.

Some people want to believe that parents always know what's best for their kids. I keep wondering what they think is the problem when mom and dad disagree, but I never bother to ask them. As far as I'm concerned, the best you can hope for is that the parents want the best for their kids - and some kids don't even get that.

[adiva_calandia]

:\ I think people suggesting that the parents are suggesting a hysterectomy to prevent rape are off the mark -- of course that's not going to be a deterrent, and that's clearly not the parents' justification.

Now, preventing pregnancy from a rape is a reasonable concern, but this is -- ludicrous. Why not try something like the Pill before going to lengths like invasive surgery?

[latenightparty.livejournal.com]

Oh, but they don't want the inconvenience of cleaning up her period blood every month, so they're going to put her through a complicated surgery! (As if they don't already clean up after her...)

[conuly]

Well, her mother apparently believes that medicine could totally mess with her kid's system. Which is a belief I can get behind - but the solution isn't to just assume surgery is the answer!

[tsukikage85.livejournal.com]

I thought they were saying that the mastectomy was to prevent rape...

[collectonian.livejournal.com]

In general, I tend to say the mother is going overboard when there are other options, but I'm no expert and don't have enough info to fully condemn her for it.

For me, the much more interesting (and somewhat disturbing) sentence was this one: "If approved, it will be the first time in Britain a hysterectomy is carried out without it being medically needed."

This seems to indicate that in Britain, if a woman wants to have a hysterectomy because she doesn't want children or periods (i.e. basically choses to have menopause early), she wouldn't be allowed? In the US, doctors are reticent about doing it for women under 30, but otherwise, it isn't blocked or banned. Am I misunderstanding that statement, or would a woman really have to get court approval to have a voluntary hysterectomy? *scratching head*

[wakasplat.livejournal.com]

What disturbs me is a tendency when it comes to injustice against disabled people, to say something like, "I'm not an expert," or "I don't know that person's case," or "I'm not sure of the complexities of the situation."

Not sure what's up with that. Not picking on you specifically either, I've seen it all over today. I see it all the time when someone does something bad to a disabled person, the idea that ordinary people can't condemn these injustices without becoming experts... or something like that.

[dandelion.livejournal.com]

It's possibly because since a hysterectomy would be free on the NHS, if it's not medically necessary it won't be granted. There are other ways to stop having periods or children. (Also, I think you don't mean "reticent" ;)

[sayga.livejournal.com]

on the last article you posted: what's all that talk about being undignified? i bet the mom is one of those people who says she never farts, because someone imagining her farting would be horrific for her. how can she take care of her daughter when she feels so much shame over her daughter's body?! it's just a body! it's not undignified to be someone who needs help caring for themselves, whether you're injured, a baby, someone with a disability, whatever. ugh. i just don't understand such body shame.

[latenightparty.livejournal.com]

I think the mother's body shame is directly contributing to her determination to keep her daughter from having sex characteristics.

[conuly]

What *is* undignified, if you ask me, is having your mother go and tell people she doesn't want you to grow up.

[fjorab-teke.livejournal.com]

I'm completely divided about this. I actually WISH I had gotten a hysterectomy at about age 16. It would have solved all sorts of problems. But unfortunately, in people it tends to bring up problems of its own. I wish I could justify one now, because I'm reaching an age where the pill is going to become increasingly dangerous to take. What then?

If the young lady is seriously at a large risk for excruciating and heavy periods and WON'T understand the pain and won't be able to moderate the pain or regulate the periods, then I see the point. If there's no way she could safely have a child, then that's an added bonus because NO other method is 100% preventive of a pregnancy in the case of intercourse (consentual or otherwise). Tubal sterilization doesn't always work, and it won't prevent the periods. If it weren't for the complications that humans tend to have with a hysterectomy (unlike cats and dogs) I would be more in favor of it in this case (for someone who won't be able to consent to it but may well be helped by it) and for myself (who CAN consent and wants it but can't afford it or its side-effects).

Ugh, what a mess. :-(

[bookgirlwa.livejournal.com]

Ah, jeez - on clicking on the Feminist LJ link I've just reminded myself *why* I no longer read that community. `CP sufferers' WTF!!!!

And why *shouldn't* we judge what parents do - sometimes parents do terrible things to their kids, even when they say how much they love them!!! Parents can have the same set of ablist assumptions and prejudice as the rest of society.

And I really really really do know what I'm talking about as far as that goes. My parents treated me like shit, and never had my best interests at heart a day in their lives, meanwhile getting all kinds of credit from the world for having a disabled child.

('scuse the rant - the Feminist comments just pissed me off, serves me right for clicking)

[latenightparty.livejournal.com]

Yeah. There are some truly horrible parents out there--mean, selfish, or just plain idiotic. So I do not agree that "parents know what's best for their children." Because often, they don't.

[conuly]

And why *shouldn't* we judge what parents do - sometimes parents do terrible things to their kids, even when they say how much they love them!!! Parents can have the same set of ablist assumptions and prejudice as the rest of society.

Some people want to believe that parents always know what's best for their kids. I keep wondering what they think is the problem when mom and dad disagree, but I never bother to ask them. As far as I'm concerned, the best you can hope for is that the parents want the best for their kids - and some kids don't even get that.

[adiva_calandia]

:\ I think people suggesting that the parents are suggesting a hysterectomy to prevent rape are off the mark -- of course that's not going to be a deterrent, and that's clearly not the parents' justification.

Now, preventing pregnancy from a rape is a reasonable concern, but this is -- ludicrous. Why not try something like the Pill before going to lengths like invasive surgery?

[latenightparty.livejournal.com]

Oh, but they don't want the inconvenience of cleaning up her period blood every month, so they're going to put her through a complicated surgery! (As if they don't already clean up after her...)

[conuly]

Well, her mother apparently believes that medicine could totally mess with her kid's system. Which is a belief I can get behind - but the solution isn't to just assume surgery is the answer!

[tsukikage85.livejournal.com]

I thought they were saying that the mastectomy was to prevent rape...

[(Anonymous)]

In general, I tend to say the mother is going overboard when there are other options, but I'm no expert and don't have enough info to fully condemn her for it.

For me, the much more interesting (and somewhat disturbing) sentence was this one: "If approved, it will be the first time in Britain a hysterectomy is carried out without it being medically needed."

This seems to indicate that in Britain, if a woman wants to have a hysterectomy because she doesn't want children or periods (i.e. basically choses to have menopause early), she wouldn't be allowed? In the US, doctors are reticent about doing it for women under 30, but otherwise, it isn't blocked or banned. Am I misunderstanding that statement, or would a woman really have to get court approval to have a voluntary hysterectomy? *scratching head*

[wakasplat.livejournal.com]

What disturbs me is a tendency when it comes to injustice against disabled people, to say something like, "I'm not an expert," or "I don't know that person's case," or "I'm not sure of the complexities of the situation."

Not sure what's up with that. Not picking on you specifically either, I've seen it all over today. I see it all the time when someone does something bad to a disabled person, the idea that ordinary people can't condemn these injustices without becoming experts... or something like that.

[sayga.livejournal.com]

on the last article you posted: what's all that talk about being undignified? i bet the mom is one of those people who says she never farts, because someone imagining her farting would be horrific for her. how can she take care of her daughter when she feels so much shame over her daughter's body?! it's just a body! it's not undignified to be someone who needs help caring for themselves, whether you're injured, a baby, someone with a disability, whatever. ugh. i just don't understand such body shame.

[latenightparty.livejournal.com]

I think the mother's body shame is directly contributing to her determination to keep her daughter from having sex characteristics.

[fjorab-teke.livejournal.com]

I'm completely divided about this. I actually WISH I had gotten a hysterectomy at about age 16. It would have solved all sorts of problems. But unfortunately, in people it tends to bring up problems of its own. I wish I could justify one now, because I'm reaching an age where the pill is going to become increasingly dangerous to take. What then?

If the young lady is seriously at a large risk for excruciating and heavy periods and WON'T understand the pain and won't be able to moderate the pain or regulate the periods, then I see the point. If there's no way she could safely have a child, then that's an added bonus because NO other method is 100% preventive of a pregnancy in the case of intercourse (consentual or otherwise). Tubal sterilization doesn't always work, and it won't prevent the periods. If it weren't for the complications that humans tend to have with a hysterectomy (unlike cats and dogs) I would be more in favor of it in this case (for someone who won't be able to consent to it but may well be helped by it) and for myself (who CAN consent and wants it but can't afford it or its side-effects).

Ugh, what a mess. :-(