So....

[conuly]

I like traditional songs. And, I like a lot of hymns. I really do. They're often quite lovely.

Of course, I don't, y'know, believe them - and somehow, I find it more uncomfortable to be singing words I don't believe than to be singing songs about murder and whatnot.

Is it ethically dubious for me to alter the words of hymns (those which aren't beautiful outside of the music, because I generally can't do as well as they do in making up words if I like them already) to be something... less wrong for me to sing? I don't mind singing general songs-about-God, so long as they're vague and don't really, uh, talk about God in anything other than an abstract sense. Or anything Biblical - stories are okay, commandments not so much. I don't know why some things pass my internal filters and others don't.

I'd just go ahead and change them, but some people (my mom) got on my case for singing Amazing Grace to the tune of Clementine, so....

(Her exact words were "You're gonna burn. Can you go sit over there? I don't want to get struck by lightning." She was being facetious. I think.)

In other news, I need to find me some sheet music for the piano. Some nice, affordable sheet music. I need to start practicing again - I forget how to read music if I don't do it often.

In other OTHER news, I need to find more people queueing up to make me icons. I have a lot of quotes, mostly LeGuin, but some not, that I want iconified, and I'm still to lazy to figure out how to do it myself.

Comments

[peebs1701.livejournal.com]

Your mom would probably go nuts at what we did in junior high. Amazing Grace was sung to the tune of "Gilligan's Island".

[conuly]

Oh damn. Now I've got that stuck in my head. You, my friend, really *will* burn for your evil, earworm spreading ways! They're evil!

Funny, but evil.

[cmarie14.livejournal.com]

I remember that!

As to your question, I would think that singing the words to a different tune should be acceptable. I'm not sure why your mom got upset. After all, Martin Luther's hymns were written to the tunes of bar-songs.

But to change the words to make them less offensive to you might be pushing it. Personally, it would bother me to hear it. Let me rephrase that. If you changed only parts of the song it would bother me, and many others.

After some thought, I think it is because you would be adulterating the meaning of the hymn, and perhaps inadvertently saying something blasphemous or theologically incorrect. Regardless, it is a sensitive issue, because the change would be an offense for many religious people, and we should be sensitive to that, as you seem to be attempting to do.

However, if you were to simply take the tune and add a brand new set of words, then you wouldn't be changing the meaning of the original text, just "stealing" the melody.

Hope that made sense. *gives big smile*

[conuly]

In fairness, it seems to me that Christian denominations differ so much on theological matters that it's unlikely I'll pick words that are completely theologically incorrect for everyone. Unless I said something like 'Save me, Satan!" which is unlikely. And hymn changing, especially for older hymns, seems to be a bit of a contest - who can change it the most? (In fairness to *that*, any time you have an oral tradition, the words to the songs will change. That's life. So the older hymns, the older ballads, even the older nursery rhymes which I had believed crystallized, they all have dozens of variations.)

[cmarie14.livejournal.com]

You are right that denominations do differ, but the differences are usually also theologically insignificant - by that, I mean that what separates the Baptists from the others is that they immerse people in water rather than sprinkling, etc. It has absolutely nothing to do with the key points of Christianity, and people who think it does are rather wrapped up the religiosity of it rather than being involved in the actual faith.

However, most hymns we sing today were initially written down. Beyond that, any changes I have ever seen (and this is what I do for my part-time living) have either been one or two words that were changed to a modern version of the same meaning, or additional verses. I would argue that while these changes have been made, they have remained consistent with the general idea of the hymn.

:)

[threeoranges.livejournal.com]

LOL! Jiggle it about a bit (repeat some clauses) and it can fit La Cucaracha...

[conuly]

Oooooh!

[mortaine.livejournal.com]

Well, the Christian rock movement has taken Eric Clapton's classic "Cocaine" and reworked it into "Get Saved," so I think you should feel free to appropriate the Christian/folk/spiritual music as much as you like.

I do not believe in god, but if I did, he or she would never punish someone for enjoying the musical traditions that stem from his believers.

[conuly]

If such a deity did, I'd probably be damned anyway for being a nonbeliever, isn't that how it works?

[sparkofcreation.livejournal.com]

Depends on which deity it was. I don't think Hindus or Buddhists (some of whom are theists) damn people. Certainly univeralist Christians (note the small U) don't; that's the definition of universalism.

[conuly]

Yes, but do they punish people for changing songs as well?

[cmarie14.livejournal.com]

"Get Saved?" Who in the world recorded that? I would love to know. It just strikes me as bizarre. :P

[(Anonymous)]

The band with the bee motif.... Stinger? Something like that.

I only know this because one of my pals in scouting was a huge Christian Rock fan.

[cmarie14.livejournal.com]

Funny, I work in the industry and I've never heard of them...

[sparkofcreation.livejournal.com]

Q: Why are Unitarians such bad singers?
A: Because they're always reading ahead to see if they agree with the words.

And while it's a common joke and marginally amusing, it is definitely also true. And most of our traditional hymns (we also have many that are just UU hymns) have already been altered (including Christmas carols).

[raleighj.livejournal.com]

Well...if my church is any indication, churches themselves will sometimes change words of hymns to make them fit their denomination's theological preferences. Like the Calvinist hymnal I have changing the line "bled for Adam's helpless race" to "bled for all His chosen race."

And I actually did a post (http://raleighj.livejournal.com/22976.html) a while back about one of the songs we had to sing in choir.

I generally don't change lyrics, because every time I start I see the ghost of the author rising up and yelling, "AUTHORIAL INTENT!!! YOU KNOW I DIDN'T MEAN THAT! WRITE YOUR OWN FREAKING SONG IF YOU DON'T LIKE MINE!" :) But I don't think it's ethically dubious, per se, since you'd be changing it something you believe is "righter." You'd probably have to be careful who you sang it around, though.

[peebs1701.livejournal.com]

Your mom would probably go nuts at what we did in junior high. Amazing Grace was sung to the tune of "Gilligan's Island".

[conuly]

Oh damn. Now I've got that stuck in my head. You, my friend, really *will* burn for your evil, earworm spreading ways! They're evil!

Funny, but evil.

[(Anonymous)]

I remember that!

As to your question, I would think that singing the words to a different tune should be acceptable. I'm not sure why your mom got upset. After all, Martin Luther's hymns were written to the tunes of bar-songs.

But to change the words to make them less offensive to you might be pushing it. Personally, it would bother me to hear it. Let me rephrase that. If you changed only parts of the song it would bother me, and many others.

After some thought, I think it is because you would be adulterating the meaning of the hymn, and perhaps inadvertently saying something blasphemous or theologically incorrect. Regardless, it is a sensitive issue, because the change would be an offense for many religious people, and we should be sensitive to that, as you seem to be attempting to do.

However, if you were to simply take the tune and add a brand new set of words, then you wouldn't be changing the meaning of the original text, just "stealing" the melody.

Hope that made sense. *gives big smile*

[conuly]

In fairness, it seems to me that Christian denominations differ so much on theological matters that it's unlikely I'll pick words that are completely theologically incorrect for everyone. Unless I said something like 'Save me, Satan!" which is unlikely. And hymn changing, especially for older hymns, seems to be a bit of a contest - who can change it the most? (In fairness to *that*, any time you have an oral tradition, the words to the songs will change. That's life. So the older hymns, the older ballads, even the older nursery rhymes which I had believed crystallized, they all have dozens of variations.)

[(Anonymous)]

You are right that denominations do differ, but the differences are usually also theologically insignificant - by that, I mean that what separates the Baptists from the others is that they immerse people in water rather than sprinkling, etc. It has absolutely nothing to do with the key points of Christianity, and people who think it does are rather wrapped up the religiosity of it rather than being involved in the actual faith.

However, most hymns we sing today were initially written down. Beyond that, any changes I have ever seen (and this is what I do for my part-time living) have either been one or two words that were changed to a modern version of the same meaning, or additional verses. I would argue that while these changes have been made, they have remained consistent with the general idea of the hymn.

:)

[threeoranges.livejournal.com]

LOL! Jiggle it about a bit (repeat some clauses) and it can fit La Cucaracha...

[conuly]

Oooooh!

[mortaine.livejournal.com]

Well, the Christian rock movement has taken Eric Clapton's classic "Cocaine" and reworked it into "Get Saved," so I think you should feel free to appropriate the Christian/folk/spiritual music as much as you like.

I do not believe in god, but if I did, he or she would never punish someone for enjoying the musical traditions that stem from his believers.

[conuly]

If such a deity did, I'd probably be damned anyway for being a nonbeliever, isn't that how it works?

[sparkofcreation.livejournal.com]

Depends on which deity it was. I don't think Hindus or Buddhists (some of whom are theists) damn people. Certainly univeralist Christians (note the small U) don't; that's the definition of universalism.

[conuly]

Yes, but do they punish people for changing songs as well?

[(Anonymous)]

"Get Saved?" Who in the world recorded that? I would love to know. It just strikes me as bizarre. :P

[(Anonymous)]

The band with the bee motif.... Stinger? Something like that.

I only know this because one of my pals in scouting was a huge Christian Rock fan.

[(Anonymous)]

Funny, I work in the industry and I've never heard of them...

[sparkofcreation.livejournal.com]

Q: Why are Unitarians such bad singers?
A: Because they're always reading ahead to see if they agree with the words.

And while it's a common joke and marginally amusing, it is definitely also true. And most of our traditional hymns (we also have many that are just UU hymns) have already been altered (including Christmas carols).

[raleighj.livejournal.com]

Well...if my church is any indication, churches themselves will sometimes change words of hymns to make them fit their denomination's theological preferences. Like the Calvinist hymnal I have changing the line "bled for Adam's helpless race" to "bled for all His chosen race."

And I actually did a post (http://raleighj.livejournal.com/22976.html) a while back about one of the songs we had to sing in choir.

I generally don't change lyrics, because every time I start I see the ghost of the author rising up and yelling, "AUTHORIAL INTENT!!! YOU KNOW I DIDN'T MEAN THAT! WRITE YOUR OWN FREAKING SONG IF YOU DON'T LIKE MINE!" :) But I don't think it's ethically dubious, per se, since you'd be changing it something you believe is "righter." You'd probably have to be careful who you sang it around, though.