conuly

People who refuse to understand where other people are coming from. Or to even try to understand.

Observe the breastfeeding thread I posted about before. Some people really think that breastfeeding doesn't belong in public (they don't like to see other people's bodies, they don't like to think about it, they think it's okay some places and not others). Others think that it is and should be okay (it's better for the health of the baby, you shouldn't have hangups about the body, you can just not look). This was the perfect place for education on both sides. Some people really don't know how to breastfeed discretely, some people really don't know that bottlefed babies(yes, even with breastmilk) have a slightly higher infant mortality rate.

Instead, we got cursing and insults from BOTH sides, with the few attempts to actually address questions being blatantly ignored. And then the survivors went to

childfree and

boob_nazis to talk about how they really showed those breaders/childhating freaks a thing or two, and to sling a few more insults from the privacy of their own community. And oh yes, the traditional slippery slope arguments "if you do this, people might as well go naked everywhere/all babies everywhere will die". I don't care and no they won't.

A similar thing happens often in

feminist where somebody will mention they're position on abortion. People get into a huge flamewar, and then wander off to

feminists4choice and

feminists4life to nurse their wounds and talk about the stupidity of the other posters.

In a similar community, somebody posted that "they don't get how those anti-choicers want to take away women's rights since antiabortionists only want women to be men's slaves again" and no I am not making all that up. Is it really so hard to see that if you're against abortion, it's because you believe that life begins at conception, and that killing a human life is murder? When I made the point, somebody asked me "although it's a good point, could you say it differently without all the hurtful language?" Um, no, I can't. That "hurtful language" is exactly what anti-abortion activists believe. I really don't know how to say that without using the word "murder" or a synonym. _{(edit) As it happens, she meant "I think you misunderstood what the original poster was saying". This rant is staying as is, though, because it doesn't work otherwise. Just note the misunderstanding, 'k?}

Mihi, the death penalty is wrong. It's so obvious, if only on the basis of "you can't ever know for certain if they did it". But even though it's a duh issue to me, I know that to other people, it's so obvious that *insert argument here*. I don't know, maybe it's just me, but when I talk to somebody about the death penalty, and they disagree with me, I don't start cursing at them. I don't say or imply that they are stupid (unless I really think they are for something else, like not knowing the difference between natural and normal...) because that means that I can't change their mind. Instead, I try to educate them to why I have my opinion, in as calm a manner as I can. And, here's the thing, I actually listen to them. I don't anticipate that I'll change my mind, in fact, I highly doubt it, but it's only common courtesy to listen to the other side. Once you've done that, you understand them. And once you understand them, you might actually be able to make a difference in what they think.

Maybe somebody could've decided "you know, it's really not that big a deal to see a little bit of breast because it's important for the kid's health and the diapers on formulafed babies really do smell worse" or "you know, maybe she really *wasn't* being discreet and could've used some advice". If you talk it through, you might find yourself saying "I know you think abortion is murder, but can I ask why?" and then explaining why you think it's not murder (and stay on topic. If they think it's murder, talking about how their views are a way for the patriarchy to keep them down isn't helping because you aren't talking about the same thing) instead of "UR SUCH A MORON!!!!!!!!!!!!!111oneONE!" In the end, isn't that more effective than yelling? As far as I know, all yelling does is dig us deeper into our little holes, back to preach to the converted.