The whole "santa debate"

[conuly]

Just so you have my views on the subject, I wouldn't tell my kids there is a santa, but I wouldn't tell anyone else there isn't unless they asked me directly. However. I think both sides in the debate are wrong. Let's look at some quotes:

Sandra Jolly said her 6-year-old son's Christmas was spoiled when his teacher told the first-grade class Monday that "Santa Claus is make-believe."

"He had this sad, lost puppy dog look on his face. This unhappy, empty look," Jolly said. "He said his teacher informed the entire class that Santa is make-believe." ... "How do you destroy a 6-year-old like that?" said Pam Sturt, whose son Bradley is in D.J.'s class.

So, tell your kids the truth now that they know. There is no Santa, and they get presents because their parents love them enough to spend money and time on them. If your kid thinks christmas is all about santa and presents for them, no matter what the age, finding out the truth is the least of your problems. Now is the perfect time to start stressing charity, giving to others, and the religious message of your choice.

Santa Claus is a part of childhood, and unless some rogues with nothing better to do than spoil everyone’s fun gets their way, he always will be.

So all those Jewish and Muslim kids, all those children in countries with no Santa tradition, they're so very much deprived. Okay. *rolls her eyes* It's a very new tradition, anyway. There's no necessity for Santa during childhood.
What's even worse it this person isn't just defending her view, she's committing the same crime she accuses others of, telling them how to raise their kids. In fact, she defends the myth by saying that it helped her grow up: "By the next year I was one of the kids on the playground telling others that they were babies if they still believed in Santa Claus. " So, you were cruel to the ignorant? That I don't respect, in anyone, regardless of age.

Personally, I'd like to strangle that teacher.

Yes. Honesty. That's a justification for first degree murder!

From the other view:

eh, the world isn't magical. I think it's better they learn the truth early on. People only tell their kids about Santa to try to get them to behave the way they want.

Yes, and I shouldn't be blowing bubbles before class. That's a rather cold view of the world.

I remember how very upset most of my classmates were when they figured out that their parents had been lying to them for years. Basically, it teaches little kids that mom and dad aren't to be trusted, because if they'd lie about Santa, what else are they lying about?

People lie. Kids have to learn that eventually. And if you're traumatized by that, that's nobody's fault but your own.

I've also got appropriate *headdesk* quotes from some magazines my mom bought...

Our 9 year old kid wants an item we can't afford. We've explained this, and now he's calling us Scrooge. My husband says we should stand firm, but I think that "if we disappoint him, his Christmas will be ruined"

*screams* That's right. Christmas isn't about family and love, and for sure it's not about Jesus, it's about the loot. And letting your kid blackmail you is good parenting. I remember very few things I got for Christmas over the years. What I do remember is spending time with my family. He won't even remember what it was by next year, and you can't afford it anyway!

My son is dating a vegan, and I don't want to invite her to my house because I love to eat meat! So much so that I can't cook, apparently, a single thing without meat products. He's trying to spoil my fun, waaah!

Grow up. Make a few things with no meat products. It's not that big a deal. You might even consider asking everyone, including her, to bring something to the table, making your burden a little lighter.

I paraphrased, but that was the general gist of the questions. *rolls her eyes*

So, folks, remember: Christmas is about the presents. Nothing more, and for sure nothing less.

On that note, I know some people who promised me LJ presents... Jenn, this is your friendly reminder that the nineteenth is upon us.

Comments

[strangelette.livejournal.com]

I'm not planning on any kids myself, but I think I fall somewhere in the middle with you. I think having a younger sibling helped because it was obvious that it was just something fun people did for little kids, although I don't remember any particular resentment. Actually, I remember being proud of myself that I found out there wasn't a santa claus, easter bunny, tooth fairy, etc all by myself.

[squittycat.livejournal.com]

I would not wish belief in Santa on any child. But I also wouldn't tell children who do already believe in him that he doesn't exist; they'll find that out on their own time eventually. I know I didn't like finding out about it. :)

As for the Holiday Season in general, I'm not a fan.

[conuly]

Eh? Why not? I always loved the lights. And the candy canes. And giving presents... weirdly, I'm not a huge fan of getting, and I've been that way as long as I can recall. I like it, of course, but I like giving better.

Oh, and the smell of dying pine trees :)

[squittycat.livejournal.com]

I don't mind the shininess too much. I do mind the consumerism. The whole idea of one time in the year that everybody has to buy buy buy... But eh, let them do whatever they want!

[conuly]

*laughs* Everyone but the babies is going to have to do Little Christmas instead. I've never bought into the consumerism at all, I don't have the cash. Mihi, the best part of Christmas is the spending time with the family, not doing much of anything, just being happy together. And the lights. If you don't like the consumerism, you don't have to participate. Let the sillies be, and know you're happier for it.

*end preachy rantling*

[squittycat.livejournal.com]

Amen.

[http://users.livejournal.com/the_silent_one_/]

I discovered there was no Santa when I found my christmas list on my Mom's desk and it had things crossed off...I was not upset at all..After I found out there was no Santa I figured there was no Easter Bunny, Tooth Fairy, and Whatever else...
I think believing there is a Santa kinda helps your childhood..it gives you imagination lets you believe..Parents these days have no imagination..their kids can be just as traumatized reading a Fantasy book..there's no Unicorns or magic..that's a lie too..but you don't see Parents going around blameing those Authors for 'lying'
Not saying that Jewish and Muslim kids don't have a imagination Cause they do..They have to believe that Praying to the north or what not will make a difference...
I think it comes down to if the parents want to let there kids believe in Santa.
/rant>

Sorry that was long..

[conuly]

1. I never believed in Santa, I had an imagination. Still do. I don't think kids need to be taught to have an imagination, nor do I think that being told something is true that isn't does that... being told something could be true is more useful.
2. The difference between fantasy books and Santa is that people don't tell their kids that the fantasy books are true.
3Not saying that Jewish and Muslim kids don't have a imagination Cause they do..They have to believe that Praying to the north or what not will make a difference...

Unless you have a general disbelief of all religion, I would have to say that I find that statement offensive, as well as ignorant. Neither religion tells people to "pray to the North", though each does have specific rules for prayer. While the first two statements are debateable and interesting mihi, this one is not. I would ask you to please not say those things in that way on my journal again.

[http://users.livejournal.com/the_silent_one_/]

Okay, that came out total wrong..I have trouble wording stuff sometimes..

1.I'm not saying Kids who don't believe in Santa don't have imaginations I'm saying that it helps your imagination along..
2.Yes I know that Fantasy books aren't true...but when you read a Fantasy book you get caught up in the Magic and that world and for the time your reading it you kinda believe it..and around this time Kids and parents get caught up in the spirit of things but as soon as the seasons over you don't have the spirit anymore...like when you put the book down..you forget all about it..IMO anyways.
3.That came out way wrong...and I apologize for that.
I don't mean to offend anyone...What I meant was that people of Different religions have Different views on things and that They believe stuff that other people don't necessarily believe...Like People who believe in Santa..there's some who do and Some who don't..Whatever.
People believe what they want to believe.

I Deeply apologize for offending you and anyone else.

[conuly]

Okay, forgiven and all that :) I know you're not somebody with whom I constantly disagree, so I figured you had meant something other than what I read anyway.

[joeymew.livejournal.com]

I believe that Christmas isn't about the presents, as much as it's about having the most lights on your house and beating out all the neighbors and having your house seen from space. But that may just be me, the person with the house that can be seen from space at night.

If I wanted children, which I don't, I'd proabably let them believe in Santa. I was never traumatized when I found out. I think it's quite rude for that teacher to go and be telling children like that. Not enough that they deserve to be strangled, but I'd just think nasty thoughts in their general direction if I ever met them. *shrugs*

[strangelette.livejournal.com]

I'm not planning on any kids myself, but I think I fall somewhere in the middle with you. I think having a younger sibling helped because it was obvious that it was just something fun people did for little kids, although I don't remember any particular resentment. Actually, I remember being proud of myself that I found out there wasn't a santa claus, easter bunny, tooth fairy, etc all by myself.

[squittycat.livejournal.com]

I would not wish belief in Santa on any child. But I also wouldn't tell children who do already believe in him that he doesn't exist; they'll find that out on their own time eventually. I know I didn't like finding out about it. :)

As for the Holiday Season in general, I'm not a fan.

[conuly]

Eh? Why not? I always loved the lights. And the candy canes. And giving presents... weirdly, I'm not a huge fan of getting, and I've been that way as long as I can recall. I like it, of course, but I like giving better.

Oh, and the smell of dying pine trees :)

[squittycat.livejournal.com]

I don't mind the shininess too much. I do mind the consumerism. The whole idea of one time in the year that everybody has to buy buy buy... But eh, let them do whatever they want!

[conuly]

*laughs* Everyone but the babies is going to have to do Little Christmas instead. I've never bought into the consumerism at all, I don't have the cash. Mihi, the best part of Christmas is the spending time with the family, not doing much of anything, just being happy together. And the lights. If you don't like the consumerism, you don't have to participate. Let the sillies be, and know you're happier for it.

*end preachy rantling*

[squittycat.livejournal.com]

Amen.

[http://users.livejournal.com/the_silent_one_/]

I discovered there was no Santa when I found my christmas list on my Mom's desk and it had things crossed off...I was not upset at all..After I found out there was no Santa I figured there was no Easter Bunny, Tooth Fairy, and Whatever else...
I think believing there is a Santa kinda helps your childhood..it gives you imagination lets you believe..Parents these days have no imagination..their kids can be just as traumatized reading a Fantasy book..there's no Unicorns or magic..that's a lie too..but you don't see Parents going around blameing those Authors for 'lying'
Not saying that Jewish and Muslim kids don't have a imagination Cause they do..They have to believe that Praying to the north or what not will make a difference...
I think it comes down to if the parents want to let there kids believe in Santa.
/rant>

Sorry that was long..

[conuly]

1. I never believed in Santa, I had an imagination. Still do. I don't think kids need to be taught to have an imagination, nor do I think that being told something is true that isn't does that... being told something could be true is more useful.
2. The difference between fantasy books and Santa is that people don't tell their kids that the fantasy books are true.
3Not saying that Jewish and Muslim kids don't have a imagination Cause they do..They have to believe that Praying to the north or what not will make a difference...

Unless you have a general disbelief of all religion, I would have to say that I find that statement offensive, as well as ignorant. Neither religion tells people to "pray to the North", though each does have specific rules for prayer. While the first two statements are debateable and interesting mihi, this one is not. I would ask you to please not say those things in that way on my journal again.

[http://users.livejournal.com/the_silent_one_/]

Okay, that came out total wrong..I have trouble wording stuff sometimes..

1.I'm not saying Kids who don't believe in Santa don't have imaginations I'm saying that it helps your imagination along..
2.Yes I know that Fantasy books aren't true...but when you read a Fantasy book you get caught up in the Magic and that world and for the time your reading it you kinda believe it..and around this time Kids and parents get caught up in the spirit of things but as soon as the seasons over you don't have the spirit anymore...like when you put the book down..you forget all about it..IMO anyways.
3.That came out way wrong...and I apologize for that.
I don't mean to offend anyone...What I meant was that people of Different religions have Different views on things and that They believe stuff that other people don't necessarily believe...Like People who believe in Santa..there's some who do and Some who don't..Whatever.
People believe what they want to believe.

I Deeply apologize for offending you and anyone else.

[conuly]

Okay, forgiven and all that :) I know you're not somebody with whom I constantly disagree, so I figured you had meant something other than what I read anyway.

[joeymew.livejournal.com]

I believe that Christmas isn't about the presents, as much as it's about having the most lights on your house and beating out all the neighbors and having your house seen from space. But that may just be me, the person with the house that can be seen from space at night.

If I wanted children, which I don't, I'd proabably let them believe in Santa. I was never traumatized when I found out. I think it's quite rude for that teacher to go and be telling children like that. Not enough that they deserve to be strangled, but I'd just think nasty thoughts in their general direction if I ever met them. *shrugs*