Question.

[conuly]

Does anybody else think that the Hogwarts Houses are self-selected? I mean, that the Sorting Hat basically just sends kids where they want to go? (And, following this, would this mean that the character traits are primarily developed after sorting, due to exposure to people who want to have the same character traits you want to have?)

Comments

[feathered.livejournal.com]

Harry's sorting would suggest that, wouldn't it?

I think it's a bit of both. After all, there are bound to be kids with low self esteem who don't recognize the qualities in themselves that would lead them to be a Ravenclaw or whatever. Neville is rather a case of this -- he's never struck me as being particularly sure of himself, especially not in the first few books.

[cumaeansibyl.livejournal.com]

Yeah, probably. Although it automatically sends anyone who might be important to the story into either Gryffindor or Slytherin, it seems. :)

[conuly]

That's because they self-select to be important. Hufflepuffs probably choose Hufflepuff so they can stay safe, and far away from the action.

[conuly]

Not just that. Everybody went exactly where they said they wanted to go - and the more they wanted to be there (Ron, Draco), the faster their sorting went. And Hermione thought Ravenclaw might be nice, and then she pops up and says that the Sorting Hat considered putting here there.

[wodhaund.livejournal.com]

I say that yes, it is, to an extent that. Harry is a case in point, when he wished for Gryffindor. One might make the claim that Draco is in Slytherin because it's expected of him, he and his family can't imagine him being anything but. Neville may very well have wished for Gryffindor in order to learn courage and strength (otherwise he seems rather Huffly to me.)

Yeah, I'd say that at least to an extent, it is self-selective. It seems more like the hat delves into the subconscious and "chooses" from that.

[cumaeansibyl.livejournal.com]

Hell, wouldn't you?

Actually, I'd probably choose Ravenclaw, and hide in the library the entire time. I'm rather surprised Hermione didn't end up there, book-fiend that she is.

[conuly]

Well, not after what happened to Cedric, I wouldn't. Ravenclaw seems safe, if a bit sue-infested. I think Beauxbatons is the safest "house" in the series :)

[lakidaa.livejournal.com]

I think it's a combination.

I mean, the kids are shown all about the houses and what kind of people go in it, right? So, the kids all do little tests and quizzes (Wizard Cosmo?) to see where they would go.

Well, that would work for most of the people.

[wakasplat.livejournal.com]

I think if someone wants to go somewhere or doesn't want to go somewhere, it adds weight (sometimes final weight) to the decision, but if they don't know anything about the Houses and therefore don't have any preferences it'd have to put them somewhere based on other qualities.

Unrepentant webcomic plug

[pockingell.livejournal.com]

As Sluggy Freelance (http://www.sluggy.com) puts it, Slytherin exists solely "because we like keeping all our bad guys in one place for simplified management." (http://www.sluggy.com/daily.php?date=020908) You wouldn't think that the Sorting Hat would send someone with the rat-bastard tendencies of Malfoy to Hufflepuff, just because they wanted to go there.

Oh, and because I went to the trouble to dig up the references, here're links to the Sluggy take on Quidditch (http://www.sluggy.com/daily.php?date=020915), and what to do with Malfoy (http://www.sluggy.com/daily.php?date=020907).

[conuly]

But they do kno something about the houses - prior to sorting them, the hat does a whole song and dance about the virtues of each house.

[conuly]

Know, sorry.

[http://users.livejournal.com/_outtonight/]

I think that a desire to be in a certain house helps weigh what the Sorting Hat decides, but the final decision is split. When I first thought about what House I would be in, I knew I was a Ravenclaw, but I wanted so badly to be a Gryffindor because I wanted to be brave. If I had been sorted based solely on my desire to be in Gryffindor, I would have been sorted into the wrong House, because while bravery and glory were something I wanted, it wouldn't have been a decision in my best interest. I am a Ravenclaw though and though, but it took me a while to accept that. If Harry had begged to be in Hufflepuff, I still think the Sorting Hat would have placed him in Gryffindor because it's the House that holds his best interests and places his qualities correctly.

[shinga.livejournal.com]

Maybe, to a degree. But even if some obviously Hufflepuff kid was like "PUT ME IN SLYTHERIN", the Sorting Hat probably wouldn't do it. o_O But if it's more of a tie... maybe the Hat lets them kind of point in one direction or another, which gives insight to a bit more of their personality and therefore, probably where they belong.

[conuly]

But would an "obviously Hufflepuff" kid do that?

Did Hermione, Ron, or Harry seem to be especially daring when they entered Gryffindor? Or Neville, is he full of chivalry? What about Draco? When he first entered the school, how ambitious was he?

I'm not so certain that these traits aren't shaped by being in the house, surrounded by people who want those traits.

[shinga.livejournal.com]

Well if they're like half the annoying teeny-bopper fans, then yes :P

The hat may have sensed that Ron, Harry, Hermione or Neville had the spark of fearlessness or honor that DOES go along with Gryffindor and could somehow tell, though I'm not sure how, that they would grow well in there. Draco had ambition... though his ambition may have been sneaky, underhanded, and more of a 'kiss-up' type that could later develop into... eh, not much more, judging by how his character is "developing".

[conuly]

Draco could've been so much more. And Dudley! God, Draco at least gets fanfic to develop in. Poor Dudley is all alone... *mocksniffles*

[shinga.livejournal.com]

Oh Dudley developes! Into a bigger, more mature brat who now cracks jokes at Harry's possible homosexual relationships. My, how he's grown. ;)

[conuly]

*snickers*

That doesn't mean I can't whine at the lack of fanfic for him. Draco is just as much a bully, and a racist, and he gets to sleep with everyone. He gets to become a good guy. He gets to have all the fun. Dudley? If he appears at all, he's married to some dumb chick, and cursed with a magical kid he doesn't want. And fat.

[shinga.livejournal.com]

And you just covered WHY. He's fat, and unattractive. No fangirl is gonna give a rat's ass about a fat bully, but if the bully is Tom Felton, OMG SO SEZZY!!1 and they write 8 million Mary-Sues to get into his pants. It's all about the pants! :P

[ex-chaos-by-699.livejournal.com]

In a way it's sort of a chicken-or-egg question. I mean, sure what you want is probably an influence on what House you get sorted into. But your innate qualities also probably influence what kind of person you want to be. People tend to interested in the stuff that they're also the most able in, and then of course they develop those abilities further by persuing those interests.

Does that make sense?

[conuly]

But in the last book, he turned into big, lean, and muscular.

[conuly]

About as much as the chicken/egg question.

[shinga.livejournal.com]

...

Eh... he did? Must've been the American version. I read the British ;) *L* Silly Americans! First we dumb words down, now Dudley is a lumberjack.

[conuly]

A wrestler... um... isn't he? That implies big, strong, and muscular mihi.