Gearing up for 9/11

[conuly]

NYC is full of cops. Heavily armed cops. Heavily armed cops who have randomly barricaded areas I normally pass through.

I fucking hate 9/11. I'm sure any future terrorist will choose some other day in which to wreak terror. Why would they pick 9/11? They'd always be also-rans. But no, everybody goes on full-alert for an attack that simply isn't going to happen. (And if it did, I'm sure they'd take the guns on the ground into account when planning. It's just security theater. None of this could've stopped 9/11, none of it could've stopped the first WTC bombing, so why do we think it'll stop anything in the future?)

Comments

[solarbird]

Typical, but crazymaking. I'm sorry.

[conuly]

Should die down by the 15th, anyway.

[cosmolinguist]

This is much less a big deal to me now that I don't live in the U.S., but I always used to hate this big ramp-up to anniversaries of the attack too. Why should I believe terrorism is more likely then? The eleventh of September was a random day, until this happened; there's no reason to expect anything different now.

[conuly]

For years, I spent the entire six weeks preceding the occasion with the TV turned off. Living through the thing once was enough, I didn't need a yearly recap.

[fairestcat]

Come September 11th I I am always incredibly happy that I no longer live in DC.

[conuly]

Yup.

[alchemia]

that kind of theatre always makes me feel less safe

[conuly]

I think that might be 75% of the agenda.

[jesse_the_k]

Geez, that sounds entirely rational and terrifying.

[conuly]

See? It's working already!

[adafrog]

I always wonder about that sort of stuff, too.

[conuly]

I've got my suspicions, and they're not pleasant ones.

[archangelbeth]

I can see why the original perps would want to hit the same date. It'd be demoralizing -- "even when you expect us, you can't stop us, neener!"

More likely, though, would be petty copycats who need a symbolic excuse to get drunk and go do something small-but-thematic.

That said, condolences on all the stupid security theater! Here's hoping it's at least quashing the fool copycats from random vandalism.

[conuly]

I can see why the original perps would want to hit the same date. It'd be demoralizing -- "even when you expect us, you can't stop us, neener!"

They're all dead! It was a blasted suicide run! Even Bin Ladin's dead now! They're dead, Jim! Dead, dead, dead as a doornail, or even a coffinnail, as Dickens would have it.

[archangelbeth]

Did we manage to take out all the masterminds as well? I can't tell. The goalposts keep moving... *shakes a fist at politicians*

[sapphire2309]

i hope you don't take this as an insult, because it isn't meant to be, it's just meant to be an observation.

countries like the uk literally have a "keep calm and carry on" attitude when it comes to large-scale tragedies like 9/11. (the meme comes from a motivational poster prepared by the british government in 1939 in case of a nazi occupation of britain etc.)

the usa, on the other hand, goes EXTRA in response to tragedies of the 9/11 scale, when honestly, while 9/11 was a tragedy, and took a lot of lives, the usa has taken more lives through policies etc. that they justify via 9/11.

this kind of history is why i can never live in the us, or most european countries for that matter. (my home country, india, has a long history of not invading and colonising other nations. though i'm uncomfortable with the nature of india's relationship with bhutan, for example, this is the kind of thing i can live with.)

[hudebnik]

Yes, I remember when the number of civilian deaths in the U.S. invasion of Afghanistan passed the number of civilian deaths in the 9/11 attacks, and thinking "OK, Mr. President, you've made your point; can you give it a rest now?"

OTOH, there are no nations with really clean hands on that score, so I'd be hesitant to pick a place to live on that basis. Rather "does the country offer enough opportunities for public input that I might be able to affect the policies that offend me?"

[sapphire2309]

true: a fair number of yesterday's colonised are today's "colonisers". i think i'd just be uncomfortable living in europe because of their specific history of colonising parts of my country.

wow. i have something resembling national pride. didn't think i did.

[conuly]

If I can make a distinction between "policies of the Indian government" and "the actual people of India", I'm sure you can do the same when it comes to the US and neither of us is insulted :)

And yes, we're always very gung ho about invasions, especially when oil is involved or potentially involved.

[sapphire2309]

Thing is, I'm not sure to what degree I'm even making that distinction. Governments, in the end, work for the perceived will of their people, or they're oppressing their people, or they're doing shady shit really quietly and just crossing their fingers amd hoping no one notices.

But on the other hand, it's been said (I don't remember where) that the perceived cultural supremacy of the US is why most Americans rarely vacation abroad, which I think is definitely traceable to the influence of the media. So, in conclusion, I don't know??

That's an important distinction to keep in mind, though, thank you for putting it so clearly!

[conuly]

Most Americans can't afford to vacation abroad, if they can even afford to take a vacation in the first place.

[sapphire2309]

holy shit really?!

[conuly]

:P

[sapphire2309]

like this is a REVELATION for me, because most of my friends in the US are in major cities and quite well-off, but then I remembered that county by county map of the US election that elected Drumpf, and the SEA of red with dots of blue. Yes, Tanya, rural America exists. /o\ I don't think i consciously realized that that was the same America as my friends live in.

[conuly]

Not just rural America - there's a lot of urban and suburban poverty.

[sapphire2309]

When you say 'poverty', are you referring to absolute or relative poverty?

[conuly]

Both.

In the NYC public school system, 40,000 students - that's about 4% - are homeless.

[moxie_man]

I never understood why they chose that date (unless it was totally random). A much better date that would have caused more deaths and probably killed our economy would have been to stage the attack on Black Friday and target big box stores/malls.


Yes, I can have a sick mind.

[conuly]

I'm sure they pulled the date out of a hat.

[thewayne]

I always wondered if they chose that date because that's the emergency number in the USA. It has a resonance, but I've never heard/seen/read it being discussed, not that I've looked for discussion on it: I avoided TV for many days after the attacks.

[conuly]

Possible, but improbable, I think.

[author_by_night]

I never thought about how upsetting it must be for those of you who live in NYC, to see that all over again. :/

Security theater

[hudebnik]

We've had armed military in desert or jungle camouflage standing around in Penn Station for sixteen years now. Sometimes you can see a cluster of U.S. army, a cluster of State police, a cluster of City police, and a cluster of transit police, each in their own uniforms, spaced fifty feet apart. I'd like to think there are some in real camouflage (i.e. business suits) as well, but I fear that it really is only theater intended to remind people that they're constantly under threat and military-style force is the only thing protecting them.

The only time I recall seeing any of this force actually being used was when a police officer got in an argument with a homeless guy in the LIRR waiting room. The officer grabbed the guy's sweater; the homeless guy said "don't grab me, don't touch me", and within seconds they were on the floor wrestling. Within another thirty seconds there were (I counted) ELEVEN police officers on top of this one homeless guy; how they could each find a part of his body to grab in between their own colleagues baffles me. But at least none of the numerous firearms present were used.

Re: Security theater

[conuly]

Eleven? I'd say our cops are a joke, but this is how people end up killed, so.

[conuly]

At least it's only once a year now.

[peristaltor]

Before 2011, there was the Oklahoma City bombing. Here in Seattle, at least, the Federal Building was on pins and needles with their security. (I've got a great anecdote about someone who forgot about that date with their rental truck and some piss-poor parking choices.)

Someday, something else will happen, and the eleventh will once again just follow the tenth. Until then, we roll our eyes and endure.

[conuly]

So, storytime? I want to read the anecdote!

[peristaltor]

Okey-doke.

I worked then as a captain driving the tour boats. A band loaded their gear with the caterers one night. That night. One of the bandies moved the truck (which I did not see; busy with stuff) off the dock, walked back.

At the end of the night, he headed back to the truck while everyone broke down the various cruise stuff. He didn't show; we told the band to get the stuff on the floating part of the dock, at least, so we could clean up the boat.

Hours later, he's still not back. Why?

He parked his rented truck in front of the Federal Building. His rented Ryder truck.

A Ryder truck… with Oklahoma plates.

By the time he got back, he was pale and shaking. He wouldn't tell us what happened to him for two hours, but wow, did they ever give him the "What the fuck were you thinking?!" treatment.

[zesty_pinto]

They would pick the day because it's symbolic, but at this point it'll be lone wolves that would do anything anyway and NYC is such a police state these days that I can't see it going anywhere anyway; I'd sooner see them try something in Boston, or the Carolinas, or somewhere else where there is potential to aim in another location just to bring it to NYC which is also liable to fail.

I feel like 9/11 is a major sore spot that deserves to be acknowledged, but it's always this one point that drives me crazy because people obsess over it on so many ends.

[silveradept]

Yes, it's become an excuse for militarized police forces to display their own terror-making capabilities. And then ask for more money to make more terror.