Bloomberg's being deliberately obtuse again.

[conuly]

Mayor Michael Bloomberg says he is sticking by the cell phone ban.

"You can't use cell phones in schools, you can't use iPods. Why can't you get the message? They're just not appropriate," he says.

For the LAST FUCKING TIME - nobody is saying they should be calling people and chatting on their cell phones during school time. Everybody is saying that the reasonable alternative is the one kids already use - turn off the cell phone the second you enter the building, and keep it off until you leave.

This way, if your mom needs to call you to tell you to hurry home and take the chicken out of the freezer, she can - after school.

I fail to see what's so difficult about this concept that he's not getting.

Comments

[brownkitty.livejournal.com]

It could be that he simply doesn't trust the students to turn the phones off, or keep them turned off.

[stejcruetekie.livejournal.com]

Sorry, but I 100% agree with the ban.

You're "alternative" doesn't work - it's NOT something that kid's "already use". They *can* - but they don't.

Leave the phones at home. Or check them in at the door.

[conuly]

Except that they do. And if they don't, then it's logical that the phones be confiscated.

[conuly]

Then he ought to say that, instead of saying things which make no sense.

At any rate, that's already been addressed - only confiscate the phones of people who are using them when they shouldn't be.

Really, this isn't exactly rocket science.

[conuly]

That is to say, it's logical to only confiscate the phones of those students who are using them during class hours.

Similarly, you're not allowed to wear non-religious hats in school. (Another rule I find absurd, but I digress.) The solution there has never been "remove all hats from students at the door, and have them completely confiscated" but "tell the students who are wearing hats to take them off, and only confiscate the hat if they keep having it on after you've told them to take it off several times".

[literalgirl.livejournal.com]

As a parent who is about to get their child a cell phone, I find it completely ridiculous that something I would buy for my son as a SAFETY MEASURE would be restricted by his school. Turn it off, yes. TAKE IT AWAY when I have paid for it in order to be able to find out where my 13-year-old autistic child is, or let him know if I am late picking him up? Outrageous.

Itis not like the pathetic public schools are going to hand-carry messages out to the throng of kids waiting for their parents to pick them up, so I can't wait until some kid gets hurt, lost, kidnapped, or injured, who would otherwise have been able to be contacted by a parent. Can't wait. Because it's stupid, and an invasion of privacy. Once my kid is off the school grounds, if I need to reach him and I've paid for the privilege, then they have no right to make that impossible.

[literalgirl.livejournal.com]

The hat thing is in Bolt's school, too. Makes me insane. And in fact, some other policy (state? district?) says that they have to be afforded the right to protected from the terrible heat and sun on the playyard, lest they get heatstroke. I should have taken them to court over this one, but I never really got around to it. It's so stupid - there is nothing wrong with a hat - they are functional and protective, especially in southern CA. Arrrghh!

:-)

[stejcruetekie.livejournal.com]

I don't know what planet you come from, because on the one I'm in, a lot of kids do NOT turn off their phones. Many do - many don't. And my experience has been in college, where I should hope the population is somewhat more mature. I can't stand to think what it must be like in high schools.

[leora.livejournal.com]

At my school, we weren't allowed to wear hats... in theory. When I started wearing a hat that wasn't a baseball cap and was an integrated part of my outfit, I was not asked to remove it. Which is semi-unfair, but kind of inline with Miss Manners, so I don't mind so much. The idea being that whether a hat needs to be removed indoors during the day depends on the type of hat, and mine was clearly a lady's hat and whether worn by a male or female, it should not need to be removed.

However, we all were allowed to bring hats to school, so long as they were removed during class. Which is not analogous to the cell phones. However, I'm too busy being annoyed by rules that forbid certain hair styles such that the students cannot even have them during weekends and afterschool hours because they are not changeable enough and the schools think they have the right to control someone's hair style for 12 years or more.

[leora.livejournal.com]

I have no idea why my parents panicked the one time they did. But I wish I'd had a cell phone back then (they just weren't common at the time). It was a 40 minute walk home for me from school (I was finishing my last year in middle school despite having moved one district over, so I was out of busing range). I often went one block in the opposite direction first, to stop and eat a bagel and have a drink before heading out. And because my father would check by there if he got off work early enough to give me a ride. So, I'd spend some time eating, and if no one showed up, I'd start walking home.

I'd done this a few times with no problems, but one time, I don't know why, my parents freaked that I hadn't gotten home nor called. Somehow they didn't see me on the walk home (a straight walk, a long walk, but completely straight - hard to get lost, even with it being a new route). And they contacted my school, and the school freaked. If I'd had a cell phone, they could have just called me and I'd let them know I was en route. When I finally got home, I found out what had happened, much to my confusion. And the whole school ended up getting a lecture about keeping our parents informed about our whereabouts. A lot of fuss and worry over nothing. All of which could have been averted with a cell phone, and saved me part of my walk.

[stejcruetekie.livejournal.com]

Turn it off, yes. TAKE IT AWAY when I have paid for it

The fact that you've paid for something which can no longer be used is of no concern to the school. The school didn't require you to buy anything.

hand-carry messages out to the throng of kids waiting for their parents to pick them up

Uhh.. Why would you need a cell phone to be picked up after school? School ends at the same time everyday, yes? Plus, if there were some kind of phone-check thing, the students can get their phones at the end of the day.

an invasion of privacy.

Huh? How?

Once my kid is off the school grounds

I believe this concerns on school grounds, not off.

they have no right to make that impossible

Although to follow up to the previous comment - they (the school) DO in fact have various rights even off grounds, when it concerns students going/leaving school. From the moment a student leaves home headed to school, to the time a student arrives at their destination after school, they are under the legal guardian care of the school/government. Whether they have this specific right regarding cell phones is up to the courts to determine.

[marveen.livejournal.com]

Possibly the kids who refuse to get that concept either.

(Don't tell me there aren't any--there are always some who deliberately refuse to abide by the rules, whether concerning running in the hallways, eating in class, or foulmouthing the teacher to his/her face.)

[phibby.livejournal.com]

Plus, if there were some kind of phone-check thing, the students can get their phones at the end of the day.

Can you imagine just how much of a hassle that would be?

I think just about every kid at my high school has a cell phone, and there are over 400 students in the freshman class alone. I can't see how taking up every single cell phone, which would be nigh impossible for the school since we don't have metal detectors or anything like that, and passing them all back out at the end of the day would work. Who takes them up? The office/administrators? First period teachers? How can you tell whose phone is whose? When exactly are they passed back, and by whom?

I don't see why a system where a kid only loses his/her phone if it goes off or if he/she is using it doesn't do the job. In my two years of high school, a phone has never gone off during class, and while I've seen many kids texting during a class, most get a warning from the teacher if/when they're caught, which generally stops it. If they get caught again, the teacher will usually take them up. And if the teacher doesn't catch them, it's the kid's own fault when they get a C on the next test for not paying attention. Why punish the kids (and ultimately the parents who might need to contact them) who don't break the rules?

[conuly]

Of course there are. And they wouldn't be detered by anything, so why make rules that affect *everybody* based on them?

[wodhaund.livejournal.com]

I do believe this is the first time I've seen you say something like "fuck". o.o

[conuly]

Because sometimes school *doesn't* end at the same time every day. Stuy certainly didn't.

Because sometimes schedules change - a club gets cancelled, or you have a last minute emergency and have to send somebody else to get the kid.

The kids can pick them up at the end of the day? Stej, have you ever *attended* a public school? I think Phy covers this issue nicely.

I believe this concerns on school grounds, not off.

Except that they're effectively telling kids they can't have phones on them from the time they leave the house until they get home - your "pick them up at the end of the day" concept is entirely unfeasible, where the "take the phones only away from the offenders" concept isn't - I can prove it.

That's the model the schools had already been using. Since the increase in metal detectors, all of a sudden they were collecting far more cell phones than before - phones which weren't being used, and which the students had never used in school. That's where all this controversy stems from.

The previous method had worked. If it hadn't, teachers and parents both wouldn't be clamoring to go back to it.

[conuly]

Oh, I've definitely typed it before. I just try to save emphatic things for, y'know, emphasis.

[conuly]

In college, nobody confiscates your phone if you don't turn it off. In college, you're treated as an adult, with the ability to choose whether or not to attend class.

Stuy and Curtis had heavy cell phone possession/use when I attended them. I know, but only because the *only* time I ever saw "cell phone use" as a problem (problem being a relative term, here) was on 9/11, when the school phones were completely clogged and everybody was frantically trying to get through to their parents on their cells (and nobody was stopping them, because this was a legitimate emergency situation).

The rest of the time I was there... I didn't see one person using their cell phone during class. I *did* see a few people being warned for using their phones during lunch, or in the halls, but not during class.

Because if they used them during class, they'd get punished, like little kids - not like adults.

[conuly]

Oh, but, you see, hats are "gang symbols" (or they can be), so nobody can wear hats.

Because, y'know, gang members just aren't clever enough to find another way to identify each other.... *dramatic eyeroll*

[literalgirl.livejournal.com]

Sounds scary!

[brownkitty.livejournal.com]

No, it's common sense. A far more rare and precious thing ;) That's why you and I, and anyone who thinks for five seconds, can figure it out, while he can't.

[literalgirl.livejournal.com]

The point being that if *I* am late (say a SigAlert that makes the freeway stop dead for an hour), if I have purchased a phone for my child, I can call the child and TELL him or her I am late. If they are already off the grounds, milling around on the street (which is what goes on there), the school is NOT GOING TO GO TELL MY CHILD NOT TO BE FRIGHTENED, or NOT TO GO WALK OFF ALONE.

By your logic, they should be able to take away my childs clothes, too, if they feel like being obnoxious. I don't really see how that works at all.

It's asinine the way the schools try to remove perfectly useful, functional, modern items merely because THEY are too lazy to deal with reality, or to set reasonable, rational rules governing said items.

From the moment a student leaves home headed to school, to the time a student arrives at their destination after school, they are under the legal guardian care of the school/government.

Can you find something for me that cites the school responsibility from school ground to home that you mentioned, since I might find that very useful in my next IEP meeting. I have never heard of this, and I have certainly never witnessed anything being done, EVER, while I was in school myself or during my son's years in school, to indicate this culpability. Thanks!

[literalgirl.livejournal.com]

*guffaw!!*

[conuly]

I can't cite anything, but that's what I was told at Stuy after a kid got his eye poked out with an umbrella.

They'd cut class, and they'd been playing swords with their umbrellas, and it was all fun and games, until....

Apparently, Stuy would've been responsible for the medical bills if only he'd left school legitimately instead of cutting. Something like that.

BTW... speaking of iPods!

[literalgirl.livejournal.com]

At the awesome school Bolt's just been accepted to, they specialize in working with kids with various LDs, and use a LOT of creative and useful assistive technology. I'd like to point out that these kinds of tools can ALSO be used constructively with the general ed population, and I think it sucks that you HAVE to be LD in order for districts (or schools in general) to appreciate their use.

Bloomberg would clearly be too ignorant to even COMPREHEND that fact that some kids might perform BETTER while writing essays or working on projects with their iPods DEPLOYED, but it is absolutely true. Sometimes kids just need to able to learn techniques for mediation of the nervous system in order to enhance their performance, and thank god Bolt's new school GETS THIS. They even made a point of talking about it during the parent tour!

I can't wait for September. The sophistication of this school has me all aflutter!